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Untitled Page
ARCHIVED FORUM -- April 2007 to March 2012 READ ONLY FORUM
This is the first Archived Forum which was active between 17th April 2007 and
1st March February 2012
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Dude1
- Joined on 09-18-2007
- London
- Posts 189
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sorry, thought you were joking. its not bad. could be better though.
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Alex
- Joined on 04-16-2007
- Bath & Cardiff, UK
- Posts 2,990
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It's actually pretty difficult to make it better, it already uses bicubic interpolation across frames, which is a pretty complex thing to do! Ie, it will use information from previous frames to fill out information in the latest frame.
Picture processing in the BeoSystem 3 is about as good as it gets.
Weekly top artists:
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wonderfulelectric
- Joined on 06-27-2007
- Posts 302
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Well I think the using of subpar components and having many compromises in terms of quality in any product is quite unacceptable. Mind you B&O used to be a cult hifi brand before the 90s when the companies finances are in turmoil. So I don't think having heavily compromised components included in their products are part of a "philosophy" at all. You see part of B&O's philosophy is to preserve the integrity of musical production and reditions of pictures, how is that going to happen when the signals are heavily polluted along the way? Of course the experience of using is important and that is the reason why many are still currently buying B&O but what I meant was B&O should start evolving with the times. You said having a digital input does not matter to you but I think it matters to many other more progressive buyers. The younger generations are more tech savvy and they are having more disposable income than ever. The kids of new money know quality and they are really going for it. Well you can say oh if you are not happy with how B&O are doing things then maybe don't buy it. The thing is I really like how well things go with each other in the B&O product lineup but couldn't tolerate the compromised approach that they have in their products that I had to settle with an alternative brand's product for better qualiy which really frustrates me cos the current system I bought isn't as pretty.
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Razlaw
- Joined on 04-24-2007
- Illinois
- Posts 1,770
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What "subpar" components are you referring?
Beovision 7-55 with Beolab 7-4, 9s and 4000s
Beovision 10-40 with Beolab 1s and 6000s
Beosound 1, 5, 2000, and 3000
Beotime, Beotalk, Beocoms
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soundproof
- Joined on 04-16-2007
- Posts 2,340
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There are some very interesting things being done by Meridian, who are uncompromising - and who are implementing DSP and digital connections in their active speakers, and B&O might want to pay attention to that Here's one example: http://www.meridian-audio.com/p_md420.htm And yes, one might wonder at the choice of drivers in BeoLab 5 - though with the active monitoring and synchronous compensation of the drivers, it's unfair to compare with the requirements of passive drivers in a regular speaker design. There are literally millions of compensations being performed to ensure optimum sound production from BeoLab 5 -- on the other hand, why serve caviar on "paper plates"?
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Alex
- Joined on 04-16-2007
- Bath & Cardiff, UK
- Posts 2,990
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expoman: In the 80's B&O used Seas drivers in the Penta's which are highly regarded drivers made in Norway. There are some now who say that the current Peerless or Vifa drivers used in the Beolab 5 are selected only for price and are not the best choice for a speaker of that price range. This is only one example of that possible debate on components. It is interesting that the Beolab Penta's were one of the most successful selling speakers B&O ever made. The Beolab 1 and now the Beolab 9 have not even come close in sales numbers of the Penta?
RE the drivers used in the BeoLab 5s:
The drivers themselves are actually of exceptional quality, and while there is possibility for even better drivers, it would yield no sonic differences. The levels of harmonic and magnitude/time distortion are as low as it gets, and 'better' drivers would just be more tonally linear, which isn't necessary due to the DSP.
Weekly top artists:
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Razlaw
- Joined on 04-24-2007
- Illinois
- Posts 1,770
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Beovision 7-55 with Beolab 7-4, 9s and 4000s
Beovision 10-40 with Beolab 1s and 6000s
Beosound 1, 5, 2000, and 3000
Beotime, Beotalk, Beocoms
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Russ
- Joined on 05-07-2007
- Washington, DC USA
- Posts 641
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Dude1: "But the System3 could be much better with regards to the upscaler." Expoman: "There are some now who say that the current Peerless or Vifa drivers used in the Beolab 5 are selected only for price and are not the best choice for a speaker of that price range." Guys, "Who"? and "How?" Its far too easy to come into a discussion like this and toss around unsubstantiated claims like those. Especially, Dude, when you make arguments about video processing in the BlueGill3 by complaining about mechanical performance in the BlowFish 2. To wit: You can tell that R-R are using a subpar EEC IV system in the Drophead Coupe because the ride in the Corniche is too plush and wallowy. It is, after all, a well known fact that 64% of all cocktail party statistics are made up on the spot. In the spirit of documented arguement, see the link: http://www.digitalroom.net/index2.html Russ
We kid because we love.
Bang & Olufsen Tysons Galleria
McLean, VA USA
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soundproof
- Joined on 04-16-2007
- Posts 2,340
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Alex: expoman: In the 80's B&O used Seas drivers in the Penta's which are highly regarded drivers made in Norway. There are some now who say that the current Peerless or Vifa drivers used in the Beolab 5 are selected only for price and are not the best choice for a speaker of that price range. This is only one example of that possible debate on components. It is interesting that the Beolab Penta's were one of the most successful selling speakers B&O ever made. The Beolab 1 and now the Beolab 9 have not even come close in sales numbers of the Penta?
RE the drivers used in the BeoLab 5s:
The drivers themselves are actually of exceptional quality, and while there is possibility for even better drivers, it would yield no sonic differences. The levels of harmonic and magnitude/time distortion are as low as it gets, and 'better' drivers would just be more tonally linear, which isn't necessary due to the DSP.
Exactly - the processors in each speaker are constantly monitoring driver performance, and adjust them accordingly, in order to ensure proper Sound Pressure Level weight and timing relative to the work they do -- for instance, the effect of the windings will drift with temperature variations, and that will affect the sound due to timing changes, unless the processor compensates... When correctly set up, the BeoLab 5s deliver an amazing resolution of the original music, due to this down to the individual air molecules monitoring. (Exaggerating slightly here.) Passive speakers, or older active designs without monitoring and DSP adjustments, might benefit from even better spec'd drivers, but in the BL5s you really have in excess of what's necessary -- those speakers behave like a jazz saxophone player compared to the pianola of regular speakers. In fairness, Meridian has taken this a step further, as you can see through the link above, in offering full-bandwidth calibration, phase adjustment, balance weighting, etc. Whether you want/need those additional tweaks is another matter. Just spent the evening enjoying my BeoLab 5s, together with friends. We always come away astonished that we can have this kind of sound in a regular little room!
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Dave
- Joined on 04-17-2007
- Brisbane, Australia
- Posts 2,328
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expoman: So does sound quality really matter or is it only about looks?
Umm i think that is a little bit extreme. I think that's it's just the balance between form and function that B&O are still trying to achieve perfectly. The newer ALT speakers are not as neat and pretty but the sound achieved is remarkable, and they are still striking. I get the feeling that as we speak, B&O are working on products in idealand that give the best of both of these worlds.
“Quality is never an accident; it is always the result of intelligent effort.”
Your health and well-being comes first and fore-most.
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jk1002
- Joined on 04-16-2007
- Boston USA
- Posts 1,620
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I don't agree with the this statement. Times move on. Some like the design of the 90ties that BL6000 and BL8000 have but we are now a century later. I like the BL3s and 5s, while not as dramatic as the 8000 the shape and combination of materials is very unique.
BS9000, BS2300, BC2, BL2500, BL3, Bl2, BS1, BV8, BC4, A8
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Dave
- Joined on 04-17-2007
- Brisbane, Australia
- Posts 2,328
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jk1002: Some like the design of the 90ties that BL6000 and BL8000 have but we are now a century later.
*decade I'm calling it as i see it, and we all have different opinions of course. I like ALL B&O design, to be frank. Since the new showroom in our city has opened which is all glass on a very busy street, alot of people that aren't usually exposed to these products, can now see them on display on this street, and i've had feedback that isn't nice from friends and acquaintances that the BL3's and BL9's are ugly. They just look like other HI-FI. It's sad, because i see the conviction in that. So the battle between from and function goes on...
“Quality is never an accident; it is always the result of intelligent effort.”
Your health and well-being comes first and fore-most.
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wonderfulelectric
- Joined on 06-27-2007
- Posts 302
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Hello Soundproof. Beolab 5s were groundbreaking when it just came out but with the lack of software oriented DSP to keep up with the current times, it is actually starting to lose out. Now you can get better than Beolab5s in room frequency response by just getting a high-surround processor or a DSP. Having said that Beolab5s are still incredible value but just not one of the best in its class.
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TripEnglish
- Joined on 10-27-2007
- America
- Posts 1,595
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It's impossible to hear every combination of speaker and amplifier on the market, so I can't outright dispute with Wonderfulelectric, though I doubt very highly that the BeoLab 5s have lost much ground in the past few years. What I would like to hear from him, however, are concrete examples of what he believes to be a better DSP system, and to what speaker/amplifier combination one could connect it to achieve a better result. Then I'd like to know how much that combination costs and what is involved in the setup. I'd also like to know if this setup exists anywhere outside of a private home so that I could personally audition it. I'd like to know which cable manufacturers he suggests and whether the system can benefit from any additional acoustical treatment outside the use of the DSP on the front end. Specifics would help greatly in my ability to judge the argument that BeoLab 5s can be bested for anywhere close to their MSRP.
There is scarcely anything in this world that some man cannot make a little worse and sell a little more cheaply. The person who buys on price alone is this man's lawful prey. - John Ruskin
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