wtlc2zpx:

jk1002:

What I do not like about Apple is the politic about marginal improvements. They always make you want the latest product, but do not exceed expecctations when it comes to improved functions. Think long song names that are scrolling in the display. Why wasn't that retrofitted to prior generations. Is just a software update, 

Maybe you have not tried the landscape/coverfow mode. It is awsome. In a few second you can identify a song in your entire library. 

He-he - was going to say it. The wheel is now virtual, with screen-interaction -- and coverflow is a brilliant representation of it.

Of course it is beautiful to look at coverflow and to play with it with your finger...

But the iPod Touch is simply a step back in usability compared to iPod as you can't use it without taking it off your pocket, you must look at the screen to do anything. The iPhone has hard buttons to push the volume up/down, and with the earset (earset 3 for iPhone...) you can stop the music with a click on the mic. That's more ergonomic, not perfect but quite good. The iPod Touch has none of those options.

Hey. How about have all loudspeakers to be upgraded to having digital connections and digital crossovers with better drive units? It will give the loudspeakers great versatility and will definitely boost the sales. If the interface with a source like the Ipod will be a problem, then produce an affordable controller with a screen readout to go with it, or if it is a whole surround solution they are after than produce a decoder and pipes out individual surround channels via wifi. If B&O ever goes down this route I will be lining up to buy their loudspeakers for sure! People want simple efficient sound systems with supreme quality now that Ipod has upped the ante in music distribution. Why produce more TVs when what they display are mostly trash anyways. People always liked B&O loudspeakers then why not focus on them and sell them like there's no tomorrow? Imagine, Beolab 4000 in the kitchen, Beolab 5s in the living, Beolab 9s in the bedroom and Beolab3s in the study all played through wifi without a need of a Beosound, and at the same time producing class leading sound quality with the help of digital signal processing. Hello... what can be a simpler and more ingenious solution to slagging sales? All the loudspeakers are active in the B&O product portfolio anyways so why not just plug in a DSP with minimal work and cost? Besides people rarely want to buy a whole entertainment system from a single brand if they are more particular about quality. 

If B&O simply add a DAC and optical input to all beolabs (it will definitely be very hard for some speakers, such as bl3's for example...), I will buy a lot of them... Next, I will buy some Airport Express (and an iPod Touch to install Remote in it) and plug them to the beolabs... B&O will then have the best audio multiroom solution, without too much effort!!!

The coverflow option also requires that you have a cover. 80% of my CDs don't. I know I can plug in the ones from Amazon and solve that but I have lots of compilations so it means much much more work for me.

 From a usability prospective, it is very far away from the brilliance that the Ipod has. Try harder, Apple. 

Yes and no. The trouble with Wifi is that you reach a limit how many wireless networks there can be at the same time. In high rise buildings you easily reach that. 

 

I had the Airport Solution running for a while, 3 synced up. It is neat, I agree. 

jk1002:

Yes and no. The trouble with Wifi is that you reach a limit how many wireless networks there can be at the same time. In high rise buildings you easily reach that. 

I think this issue is now solved with i802.11n, as the signal can actively jump from one channel to another depending on the reception quality. I can easily find more than 20 wifi networks in my flat (I live in Paris...), and everything works correctly with airport (excepted the radio bug, but with airfoil it works...). The area is totally saturated with wifi, GSM and other wireless networks but no problem with airport...

Oh that will be easy. See the current crossovers that B&O use in most of their loudspeakers are active and if you change them to all digital then the space occupied by the DAC will be almost equivalent. Having digital crossovers and digital inputs are not all about convenience, it has a lot to do with sound quality as well. An already good quality pair of speakers will be transformed to class leading just by replacing normal passive crossovers to digital. Thing is I don't understand why B&O is not doing this already with all of their loudspeakers. They will have significantly tap into the demand of a whole new market with this upgrade. I am sure older Beosounds can be retrofitted with digital outputs easy to match the new upgraded loudspeakers. 

Not true.

Changes have been immediate. You just dont see them at the coal face. Yet.

Can you explain more Dude1... Do you mean that I will be able to upgrade my current Beolabs with a digital input??

A digital input on most of the BeoLabs will be as useful and beneficial as a chimney on a submarine.

Explain to me Alex. How so? Don't just do a hit and run. Integrating a DSP into a loudspeaker's design is greatly beneficial. The more you integrate a sound system, the shorter the signal path, the more the components will be in sync with each other and not to mention the cost savings by doing so. Many professionals are moving on to using digital loudspeakers because they can tailor the sound easy just by using a software. Well, I am not suggesting that B&O build their loudspeakers to such high level of technicality, I am simply suggesting a great way to sell their loudspeakers and not to mantion fulfilling my demand for a more advanced product. 

Alex:

A digital input on most of the BeoLabs will be as useful and beneficial as a chimney on a submarine.

Hmmm.

Jandyt:

Alex:

A digital input on most of the BeoLabs will be as useful and beneficial as a chimney on a submarine.

Hmmm.

 

Hilarious JandyT!!  Leave it to the Brits to still be using coal-burning submarines.  I think Andy would have done better to use 'screen doors' as oposed to 'chimney'.

 On to the question at hand though....

Adding S/P-DIF inputs to a speaker isn't as easy as some here are making it out to be.  Putting aside the raw technology for just a moment, where on a BeoLab 3 for instance, does one put the extra connection?  Where indeed, does one put the extra chipset inside a BeoLab 3?  Or a 4?  The older speakers (4000/6000/80000), could at least sacrifice the existing RCA analog socket, but then we're giving up a feature, no?  

What cost difference are we willing to tolerate?

Given that only 2 current Audio masters support dighital output, with only the BeoSound 5 looming in the foggy middle distance, what is the actual benefit, particularly when most of us would be playing compressed files for the forseeable future?

Russ 

Well RussR. There many ways to do it. Simply switch all the analog components to digital and create an outboard A/D converter like many digital loudspeaker manufacturers do or build an A/D converter in like the BeoLab 5. The thing is many components such as a cd player or a computer have digital outputs and not necessary analog outputs or should I say computers with analog outputs are almost always of inferior quality, so having a digital input  will make B&O loudspeakers more versatile and have greater control over sound quality.

True that most are listening to compressed files now but that doesn't mean having a build in DSP would not improve sound quality. Most of the people in this thread seems to thinking what I am refering to is to just add a digital input to the loudspeakers but what I am saying isn't that, it is to have a pure digital path in the crossover and equalizing process instead of the current analog one. It is very different from say some loudspeakers with a digital input and follow the usual D/A and then an active crossover route.

Having a DSP built in or integrated into a loudspeaker design means virtually eliminating any colouration from the loudspakers by the use of digital equalization with minimal or immeasurable loss unlike say using an active crossover/ equalization or passive crossover. So yes having a DSP loudspeaker will improve any sound system regardless of source quality. Also, there are emerging technologies in the digital arena that will improve compressed audio such as the ingenious solutions created by Linn and Meridian.

cheers

Alexander

But, what about the volume control?? A digital input needs a processor with volume control... Beo4/5 for a pair of BL4?? Have you though about it??

They don't necessarily need to have variable volume, although it would be ideal.

I agree RE the use of DSPs, but this too has it's disadvantages, mainly cost related...

So I was saying in one of my previous posts, if need be B&O can make an affordable separate control module with a display screen for interface with other brand products that do not have a digital volume control. Regarding costs, if B&W zeppellin can afford a build in DSP I don't see a reason why even the most affordable of B&O loudspeakers can't have a DSP build in, and not to mention that B&O owns a chip manufacturing plant. Maybe B&O can offer 2 versions, a higher end model digital version and the normal active version. I am sure with B&O's made to order manufacturing that can be done easy.

I think the serious problem with B&O is that the products they make are neither here nor there. Look at the Beolab 3s, very ambitious no? But the components they use are subpar and thus not the best miniature loudspeaker out there, and this goes to all of the products in the lineup. They are just not letting themselves be taken seriously. Sure B&O can charge more for if they decide to use better components in their products and I bet it will not hurt the sales, in fact it might help it a lot. They are losing big chunk of the growing videophiles, audiophiles and technophiles markets out there. B&O just can't market themselves like Bose, because they are simply charging a hell lot more and many shoppers at this price range do hire specialists to design their entertainment systems for them. And I am very sure that not many of those specialists are a fan of B&O. B&O is virtually the monopoly of luxury arthouse electronics market, there must be a reason why it isn't as successful as it should be.

Well, first, excuse my english...

The real question is that including digital inputs in the beolabs (use the current tecnology) will really change the experience of use them.

I think that B&O dosen't really care about the ways of the tecnology, but use it to offer experiences. It's its philosophy and i think that we have to accept it.

I don't care about the components of my BLs 3, and the tecnology that B&O has used to make it. I only know that this beolabs sounds better than any speaker that i've ever heard before, with the same caracteristics. SPDFI in?? Why?? This will be a plus in my BLs?? I don't think it... I don't really care.

Well said Joaquín!
If it looks good, sounds good, and still has the wow factor, who cares?
PS, your english is just fine!

Andy T.

Its a good point, i think all manufacturers could always use "better" components and it is true that Bang could use better components in some products - such as BangLab 8000 speaker cones....or upscalers in some video components, say for example the Bangsystem3.

Fair call.

I think you'll find the upscaling in the BeoSystem 3 is as good as it gets

lol!

Meaning?