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Latest post 05-12-2011 6:44 AM by Electrified. 98 replies.
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  • 04-18-2011 10:58 AM In reply to

    Re: Beosound 5 Encore.... not until after summer !

    If it has no AUX/line out and there is no masterlink/beonet converter why would they want to bother launching it? Why burn marketing dollars on something that most of the existing customers could not use in their setups?

    Adding a line out together with a Beo 6 and its macro/programmed function could have achieved an "integrated" device.

    Maybe that is why they delay it further.

     

     

     

    BS9000, BS2300, BC2, BL2500, BL3, Bl2, BS1, BV8, BC4, A8

  • 04-18-2011 12:28 PM In reply to

    • Evan
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    Re: Beosound 5 Encore.... not until after summer !

    I didn't know there were different AAC formats.... I feel like this might get confusing!

    Which of those (or which other one) does Apple use? That's all I'm worried about!

    Evan

     

  • 04-18-2011 12:56 PM In reply to

    • mbee
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    Re: Beosound 5 Encore.... not until after summer !

    When you buy songs from Apple, they are in lossy AAC 256kbit/s.

    If you don't touch anything on your iTunes setup, that would also be the conversion format for your CDs when you rip them.

    You can set iTunes to rip CDs to Apple Lossless. That's an other kind of file.

    And rumors says that Apple will go 24bits/96KHz (instead of the old 16bits/44KHz of the CD) in the future : that will be a great news, if prices stays the same... But not a great news for players such as the Beosound 5 if they don't choose the FLAC file format...

  • 04-18-2011 3:11 PM In reply to

    Re: Beosound 5 Encore.... not until after summer !

    But there are already download sites which sell 24bit/96kHz Flac.

    Same old discussion: Apple should make their lossless format decoder available for free. One can play AAC/M4a/M4b/AACplus/etc. on a Mac, on a PC, etc (licenced by Dolby Digital) but not the Apple lossless format (licenced by Apple)

    Note: it takes only some minutes to convert from Apple lossless to FLAC (or vice versa) or from Apple Lossless to WMA Lossless (or vice versa). 

     

    And lossless = lossless; independent if it is Apple, FLAC, OGG or WMA


  • 04-18-2011 3:59 PM In reply to

    • Evan
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    Re: Beosound 5 Encore.... not until after summer !

    I always thought iTunes' standard rip bit rate was 128. I understand the lossless bit/process and have been using apple lossless for quite some time.

    I'm just worried about AAC. Did that huge update for BeoSound 5 Classic add AAC? I remember someone else asking about it...

    I'm surprised that everyone has been able to live without this format.

    Evan

     

  • 04-18-2011 6:47 PM In reply to

    Re: Beosound 5 Encore.... not until after summer !

    The reality is that iTunes, whether on purpose or not, makes living with lossless a real hassle. Sure you can do Apple Lossless, but then it won't play on anything but an Apple product. Or you can use other formats, like WAC or FLAC, and have no way to manage the formats within iTunes and have to manage meta-data yourself. 

    Simple google searches tell the story better and more completely than we can here. 

    For what it's worth, 320kb MP3 files sound pretty damn good on just about anything, including the BeoSound 5 and that's the choice I've made personally. 

    There is scarcely anything in this world that some man cannot make a little worse and sell a little more cheaply. The person who buys on price alone is this man's lawful prey. - John Ruskin

  • 04-18-2011 10:51 PM In reply to

    Re: Beosound 5 Encore.... not until after summer !

    To be honest, I am mostly after apple lossless because that seems to be the anwser for gapless playing for live recordings and classic.

    Also I don't want multiple libraries and am in a mac only environment.

    BS9000, BS2300, BC2, BL2500, BL3, Bl2, BS1, BV8, BC4, A8

  • 04-19-2011 3:19 AM In reply to

    Re: Beosound 5 Encore.... not until after summer !

    jk1002:
    seems to be the anwser for gapless playing for live recordings and classic

     

    ever thought to rip classical cd's as one file?

     

    @Evan

    Since Windows Media Player 11 & 12 AAC can be played on a PC quite easily Yes and even on a BS5 (see spec's om B&o site)


  • 04-19-2011 3:22 AM In reply to

    Re: Beosound 5 Encore.... not until after summer !

    Apple does not license Apple Lossless, so B&O is not really to blame here, and they've explained that on their website.

    That said, Sonos and other companies, have reversed engineered it, and Apple isn't complaining.

    p.

  • 04-19-2011 4:24 AM In reply to

    Re: Beosound 5 Encore.... not until after summer !

    My Parrot RKI8400 car radio can play Apple Lossless with the Ipod connected to it, why could'nt B&O products do the same??

    There will always be a format war, and people have to chose at one stage.I chose WMA Lossless, then Apple Lossless because they are lossless formats.

    The pragmatic reason being: where do you rip CDs? On your computer..

    What types of computer standards do you have? PCs and Macs..

    What are their lossless proprietary formats? WMA & Apple Lossless..

    To me, all the other lossless formats are not the right solution.Am I supposed to have 2 libraries at home? One for BS5 and one for my Ipod? That is not acceptable.

    The problem with B&O is that, even in their own range, there's no logic! My Serenata plays WMALossless but the BS2 can't..nor can the BS6..which plays different formats than BS2 and the Serenata!I won't even talk about the BS4 SDHC card that won't work on BS3..Surprise

    Reunion Island is greeting you!

  • 04-19-2011 4:30 AM In reply to

    Re: Beosound 5 Encore.... not until after summer !

    Your Parrot does not play Apple Lossless, your iPod does.

    If you want a solution to play music from your iPod or iPhone, there is the BS8 or the iPod dock that is controlled by PUC.

  • 04-19-2011 5:02 AM In reply to

    • mbee
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    Re: Beosound 5 Encore.... not until after summer !

    And FLAC is becoming an industry standard : there are a lot of online stores that sells Flac as lossless format. And the ONLY high definition format (24bit/96kHz) format that we can find on those stores is FLAC. So FLAC for lossless seems to be a good choice.

    And the fact that lossless is lossless is also quite good for batch converting an entire library : you don't have to bother about quality loss!

  • 04-19-2011 5:11 AM In reply to

    Re: Beosound 5 Encore.... not until after summer !

    Chrisreunion:

    My Parrot RKI8400 car radio can play Apple Lossless with the Ipod connected to it, why could'nt B&O products do the same??

     

    My BS3000, my BS7000, my B&o...... can pay Apple Lossless with my Ipod or Ipad connected.

    My BV7 can play Apple lossless with a Apple TV connected............

     

    so what's the point


  • 04-19-2011 5:44 AM In reply to

    Re: Beosound 5 Encore.... not until after summer !

    Whistle

     

    BS 1, BeoCom 2, 2x LC 2, Form 2,  BS 2, BS 3, 2x Beo 4, BS 5, BM 5, BL 5,Beo 6, BS 6, 2x A8, BV 8-40, BL 8000, 3x A9 Keyring, Serenata, BeoTime, BeoTalk 400

  • 04-19-2011 5:49 AM In reply to

    Re: Beosound 5 Encore.... not until after summer !

    alenvprekrsku:

    Whistle

     

    Right!

    And what about the potentials if "all" PC users would switch to Apple lossless.


  • 04-19-2011 6:43 AM In reply to

    Re: Beosound 5 Encore.... not until after summer !

    Never! PC users have FLAC. Geeked

    BS 1, BeoCom 2, 2x LC 2, Form 2,  BS 2, BS 3, 2x Beo 4, BS 5, BM 5, BL 5,Beo 6, BS 6, 2x A8, BV 8-40, BL 8000, 3x A9 Keyring, Serenata, BeoTime, BeoTalk 400

  • 04-19-2011 6:55 PM In reply to

    • Stan
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    Re: Beosound 5 Encore.... not until after summer !

    Evan:
    I didn't know there were different AAC formats.... I feel like this might get confusing! Which of those (or which other one) does Apple use? That's all I'm worried about!

    There are different AAC parameters (bitrate, fixed vs variable), just like there are different mp3 parameters.  BS5 has supported unprotected AAC all along, however, it does not support Apple lossless (which isn't really AAC) or "protected" AAC files (containing Apple DRM).  I've never really worried about fixed vs. variable rate...

    Stan

  • 04-20-2011 4:31 AM In reply to

    Re: Beosound 5 Encore.... not until after summer !

    Replying to Carolpa:

    Yes, any sound system can play your Ipod sound through aux input, including a BeoMaster 8000, it doesn't mean it can control anything or show the album covers.

    My Parrot car radio connects to my Ipod with the Apple cable and acts like the Ipod player, it shows the album covers, and the whole navigation is made on the radio system; and it recharges the Ipod as well. The Ipod is not even visible, it is hidden behind the receiver's fascia.

    And yes, you can use FLAC if you want to, but there is no way to make it play on Itunes or an Ipod, so what's the solution for Mac users who want lossless audio??

    Why can companies like Sonos do that, and not B&O?Hmm

    Reunion Island is greeting you!

  • 04-20-2011 4:54 AM In reply to

    • mbee
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    Re: Beosound 5 Encore.... not until after summer !

    As the systems that can read Apple Lossless are created by reverse-engineering and no full specification from Apple, I would not be totally satisfied with such a solution : what proves that I get the best possible quality out of my lossless track? I prefer to have a FLAC track that is decoded by a documented process and not a trick.

    The company to blame is not B&O here, it's Apple for :
    -Not supporting the universal lossless and HD audio format available everywhere (FLAC)
    -Not allowing 3rd party brands to add support of Apple Lossless.

    Anyway, I have come to the conclusion that for now, I can't have a unique library for my iStuff and my high quality home audio system : lossless tracks takes too much space for portable things, and gives no audible advantage with my earphones or car audio. So currently I have a small portable library on my Mac and a huge library on my NAS (the tracks are approximately the same, only the quality is different)

  • 04-20-2011 6:28 AM In reply to

    Re: Beosound 5 Encore.... not until after summer !

    Chrisreunion:

    Why can companies like Sonos do that, and not B&O?Hmm

    Because it is illegal to do so.

  • 04-20-2011 6:55 AM In reply to

    • psand
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    Re: Beosound 5 Encore.... not until after summer !

    PhilLondon:

    Because it is illegal to do so.

    You are the programmer, so I'd suppose you have reflected on this. But why should it be illegal to reverse engineer and re-implement a proprietary format, which on the one hand is undocumented and not available for licensing, but on the other hand is not patented? As far as I understand, the open source library that Sonos uses (libavcodec) does not build upon any Apple documentation or Apple code. The original reverse engineering was made by David Hammerton and is released as freeware, not even GPL.

    I'd rather guess B&O wants to avoid Apple Lossless because the format is subject to change without notice from Apple.

  • 04-20-2011 3:14 PM In reply to

    Re: Beosound 5 Encore.... not until after summer !

    Sonos is streaming from iTunes. It does not have any internal memory of its own. So it's not decoding Apple Lossless, the computer is. It's like saying that your headphones, once plugged into your MacBook, can decode Apple Lossless. 

    If there's an Apple Device in the playback chain, Apple Lossless is possible. If not, not.

    What we really need is FLAC support in iTunes or a reasonable alternative as a computer media manager. 

    There is scarcely anything in this world that some man cannot make a little worse and sell a little more cheaply. The person who buys on price alone is this man's lawful prey. - John Ruskin

  • 04-20-2011 4:11 PM In reply to

    • mbee
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    Re: Beosound 5 Encore.... not until after summer !

    TripEnglish:
    Sonos is streaming from iTunes. It does not have any internal memory of its own.

    Trip, don't speak about Sonos if you don't understand it : Sonos IS decoding Music. I think you where thinking about the Apple Airport express...

    Sonos can work without any computer running : the ZonePlayer finds a NAS in your network, index all the music, and plays it independantly (or in sync with other Sonos items). A computer can be a source, but it's not mandatory, a NAS is sufficient. In B&O words, a ZonePlayer is REALLY close to a Beosound 5 Encore.

  • 04-20-2011 5:15 PM In reply to

    Re: Beosound 5 Encore.... not until after summer !

    Agree that's why in a separate post i suggest that the encore is an expensive sonos zone player
  • 04-21-2011 9:49 AM In reply to

    Re: Beosound 5 Encore.... not until after summer !

    Hmmm.

    In my humble opinion both are completely different things. Otherwise a Ferrari is just an expensive Fiat, clearly is not the case. Is just similar products to completely different clients/markets.

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