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ARCHIVED FORUM -- April 2007 to March 2012
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This is the first Archived Forum which was active between 17th April 2007 and 1st March February 2012

 

Latest post 04-03-2008 8:46 PM by Peter Jacobs. 35 replies.
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  • 03-04-2008 7:11 AM In reply to

    Re: Most peculiar Lab5 Vibrations

    Thanks Beoaus. I shall try them this weekend. Only problem is I understand it is not advisable to have a shiny reflective surface underneath the speakers ??....

     

    Here is my room with speakers positioned. I have now brought them away from the walls by about 1.5 feet. 

     

     


     

     

     

  • 03-04-2008 8:03 AM In reply to

    Re: Most peculiar Lab5 Vibrations

    peterjacobs:

    Thanks Beoaus. I shall try them this weekend. Only problem is I understand it is not advisable to have a shiny reflective surface underneath the speakers ??....

     

    Here is my room with speakers positioned. I have now brought them away from the walls by about 1.5 feet. 

     

    The image is not coming up on my browser. Try storing it in jpg? Go to Options, next to Compose above. And add the image with the Browse function, if you haven't already done so.

    And shiny reflective surfaces can't be much of a problem, as most of the photography by B&O of these speakers goes against that bit of advice. But the marble doesn't have to be smooth polished - and it could look quite beautiful - imagine dark marble slabs underneath? (Damn, I'm going to get curious and be wondering about getting my own, now.)

  • 03-04-2008 8:53 PM In reply to

    Re: Most peculiar Lab5 Vibrations

    I'd like to know more about the joists supporting your floor.  The BL5s have enough power to actually cause the floor to move if it isn't stiff enough, and that may be the cause of what you've noticed.  

    I thought my studio floor was plenty stiff until I installed the BL5s.  Then I noticed some severe deflection problems.  This past year, as part of studio rehab, I put little lolly colums under each speaker in the crawl space to "ground" them by restricting their motion, and it tightened up the bass considerably.  You might consider something similar.  

    I would warn you off Audissey, not because it doesn't work (it does - we've measured it) but because it doesn't work as well as ABC for this sort of problem.  

    I hope this helps.  

    Thanks for listening.  
    Dave Sausalito Audio LLC
  • 03-05-2008 12:37 AM In reply to

    • kawo
    • Top 150 Contributor
    • Joined on 04-17-2007
    • Posts 516
    • Founder

    Re: Most peculiar Lab5 Vibrations

    Dave, could you please share some more details of your expirience with the audyssey device? You mentioned that this could not be a promising solution for the problem of  the starter of the thread.

    I have treated my room with some acustic elements after consulting an acustical expert and looking now into the last step to imptove the sound.

    So the Audyssey is on my list as I heard from owners of very well acustical treated rooms that this device the "cherry on top of the cake" . I have two lab5, lab 7-4 and two lab 3 with a BS3 in my 3,60 by 4m room

    Karsten 

    _________________________________________________________________________

    BV4-50, Beosystem 3, Beolab 5, Beolab 3, BV3-32, BV1, BS9000, Beolab 4, Beolab 2000, Beo4 Cinema

  • 03-05-2008 2:17 AM In reply to

    Re: Most peculiar Lab5 Vibrations

    The disadvantage with Audyssey is that it processes the signal, and therefore reduces its resolution a little; the advantage would be that it treats the entire frequency range relative to the room, and not just the bass.

    I can attest to the BL5s being able to move walls and floors. When we were watching the latest Bruce Willis Die Hard movie, and we got to where it's the truck against the jet fighter on the highway overpass, the entire apartment building seemed to be shaking as the overpass was falling apart. Big Smile 

    Stiffening up the floor from underneath is a good idea, with possible a higher WAF than the slabs! 

  • 03-07-2008 5:52 AM In reply to

    • kawo
    • Top 150 Contributor
    • Joined on 04-17-2007
    • Posts 516
    • Founder

    Re: Most peculiar Lab5 Vibrations

    Die Hard 4.0 with the Lab5 is the best! My sofa vibrates...and not only a little bit :-)

    Karsten 

    _________________________________________________________________________

    BV4-50, Beosystem 3, Beolab 5, Beolab 3, BV3-32, BV1, BS9000, Beolab 4, Beolab 2000, Beo4 Cinema

  • 03-07-2008 8:53 AM In reply to

    • dp
    • Not Ranked
    • Joined on 06-28-2007
    • Posts 47
    • Bronze Member

    Re: Most peculiar Lab5 Vibrations

    not wanting to go too off topic but the bridge scene in Mission Impossible 3 is awesome (volume 70) Unsure

    much better with lab 5s than beolab 2..

  • 03-07-2008 9:38 AM In reply to

    Re: Most peculiar Lab5 Vibrations

    In response to Kawo's post about Audissey, my business partner Manny LaCarrubba undertook a study of various room correction systems as part of a project we are currently working on.  Audissey was one of the systems - it is a full bandwidth system and Manny's conclusion is that it works OK, and has a nice user interface, but that he prefers the outcomes obtained by some of the other systems under test better.  

    In this case, the problem is clearly a low-frequency problem and ABC should handle it quite well.  The fact that it doesn't appear to be handling it well suggests to me that the entire floor is being excited, resulting in a large vibrating membrane (the floor) whose response cannot be adequately controlled by altering the response of the exciters (the BL5s).  Hence my suggestion of floor supports directly under each speaker, to restrict floor motion at the speakers, effectively making them nodes.  This should help.  

    In general, I do not support the idea of overlaying two room correction systems – I can imagine serious interactions and unanticipated consequences.  Given Kawo's excellent system, I'm not at all sure that Audissey would yield much if any improvement, while it might actually degrade the performance of the BL 5s.  

    I hope this helps.  

    Best regards,
    Dave Sausalito Audio LLC
  • 03-07-2008 9:53 AM In reply to

    Re: Most peculiar Lab5 Vibrations

    Dave,

    would setting a cross-over with Audyssey or another system above that handled by the BL5s for the rest of the frequency range be advisable?
     

  • 03-17-2008 9:01 AM In reply to

    Re: Most peculiar Lab5 Vibrations

    Peterjacobs did you find a solution?

  • 04-03-2008 8:46 PM In reply to

    Re: Most peculiar Lab5 Vibrations

    Ok all, thanks for all your responses and debates especially Dave Moulton. 

     I went off to our local DIY store and got 4 650 mm square concrete pavers.Two sandwiched together to make a concrete plinth about 5 inches high. Placed the Lab 5s on these. Re calibrated and then used a couple of B&O demo CDs to test any change. I also played the DTS DVD Terminator 3. Not much change at all. Interestingly I did noticed by standing right next to the lab 5s that (when they were on the concrete plinths and without being on them too)  that when the calibration sequence started for the bass frequencies I could lliterally feel the floor boards deflecting.

    Now Dave Moulton asked a very focussed question. The size of the joists supporting the floor. Well, (don't do this at home) I had to go off to our local pest control, get some "spider dispersal bombs" let them off under the house. Then wait an hour before crawling underneath. The gap is just over 24". The floor joists are solid hardwood, 6" x 8". The floor itself is solid hardwood boards 3/4" thick.

    So, I took the lab5s off the plinths, then placed the US "Big Fat Dots"  speaker vibration damping pads (note these can be used for speakers up to 90 kilos). Re calibrated, then played the same tracks and DVD.

     Result - A HUGE DIFFERENCE, POSITIVE of course. I anticipated that it would be better, as when I started the calibration I stood next to the speakers and did not notice MUCH deflection of the floor boars all though there was a hint of it. I re calibrated again and this time sort of leaned on the larger aluminium disc of the lab 5s. Now no deflection of the floors.

    End result, the 5s are back to their best. !!!!!!!

     I actually took a day off work today to enjoy them, just to celebrate.

    Herbies Audio Lab. They are on the web. $ US 70 + $US 25 postage to Australia. for 10 discs. $ placed in a square and one in the centre.

    Hope this helps anyone else with the same problem.

    Peter 

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