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Latest post 02-08-2012 6:11 PM by Leslie. 10 replies.
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  • 02-07-2012 2:17 AM

    • yachadm
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    Replacement dust covers for Tangential BG400x, BG6000 series - economic feasibility

    I have had some requests from customers to replace existing original scratched and/or broken dust covers.

    The originals, as we all know, were made from acrylic plastic, which crack around the mounting screws, and scratch easily.

    In the course of investigating the worthwhileness of this project, I concluded that any replacements must address those issues beyond any doubt, and basically last for ever.

    So, I have come up with initial numbers for a grey smoke-coloured (almost identical to the later 4004 color), POLYCARBONATE (not acrylic / perspex), 5mm (as opposed to the original 4mm).

    Polycarbonate is extremely strong, light, non-scratchable, and about 60% more expensive than acrylic, and is used here in Israel instead of glass in shop windows, bus-stops, etc to minimize casualties from suicide terrorists blowing up civilians.

    Custom (and expensive - Eu2100) tooling is required to identically duplicate the original structure, and owner workmanship requires only removal of the original alumininum strip, cleaning off its residual glue, applying new contact adhesive, screwing in the hinges, and replacing the aluminum strip.

    I do not have any pictures of a prototype, as that would require the tooling investment. It would be an identical duplicate copy of the original, except for the 5mm thickness, which has no functional or aesthetic influence.

    I have to make a minimum order of 100 units, and the price will be Eu72+ about Eu18 shipping from Israel to Europe or the USA. If I can get enough interest for 1000 units, the price drops to Eu54.

    This is a "community" price, without any concerns of private profit here, and priced well below that which ordinary generic acrylic turntable dustcovers sell for on ebay.

    Shipping will be 3-4 weeks from placing the order.

    Obviously, I cannot subsidize such a large amount, and I would like to see if there is sufficient interest here to make a go/no-go decision for 100 units.

    Comments are welcome

    Menahem Yachad

    Learn from the mistakes of others - you'll not live long enough to make them all yourself!

  • 02-07-2012 3:14 AM In reply to

    Re: Replacement dust covers for Tangential BG400x, BG6000 series - economic feasibility

    I think this is a very worthy project but from past experience, I doubt you will get 100 orders let alone 1000. The 4000 series of decks are becoming less common and those that do exist are usually fairly cossetted. There is also the matter of the trim parts which are often aging and I take it would need transplanting. I do wish you ever success in this project though.

    You are correct that turntable lids are expensive - I had a couple commissioned for my Thorens 3000 and they were considerably more than you are quoting and that was for fragile acrylic.

  • 02-07-2012 7:08 AM In reply to

    Re: Replacement dust covers for Tangential BG400x, BG6000 series - economic feasibility

    Because of the difficulties that I have experienced while trying to remove scratches by polishing using a variety of techniques and materials, I sent a Beogram 6000 dust cover to a professional outfit. They informed me that the originals are made from polycarbonate not acrylic and virtually impossible to restore to "new" condition. I was told the same story by another contract restorer on the internet.

    They made a "fair" job of the polishing but they struggled and it took a lot longer than they had anticipated! I will not be sending another.

    The later 3000-7000 series dust covers are made from moulded acrylic sheet and can be restored using conventional polishing techniques similar to those used on light aircraft windows, car headlights and motor cycle fairings etc..

    Removing and replacing the thinner of the aluminium strips used on the original covers is impossible to do to my own satisfaction. Simply cleaning the old glue off and replacing with fresh is NOT sufficient as the strip ends up looking like ripples on a beach. Some means of manufacturing a new strip would need to be found.

    100 Euros is about £83 at current exchange rate. Like Peter I suspect you might struggle to find enough people willing to pay that sort of money. There will be any number of people who will say that it is a brilliant idea and of course they would buy one. It may well be a different matter when you come to collect the money!

     I may well be a customer for the odd one or two for use on paticularly nice turntables that could justify the spend.

    How many enthusiasts for that type of turntable are there? Certainly many more than those found on BeoWorld but how many would want to pay £83 for a new dustcover? When it comes to it, not that many.

    Regards Graham

  • 02-07-2012 8:53 AM In reply to

    • yachadm
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    Re: Replacement dust covers for Tangential BG400x, BG6000 series - economic feasibility

    Points well taken!

    I highly doubt the accuracy of those restorers claiming that the originals are polycarbonate, because the same substance I intend to use is impervious to scratches - I tested it hard rubbing with a dry towel to see what the effect would be, and it remained mirror smooth.

    Of course, there may be variable grades of polycarbonate, but the only scratch I managed to make on the test sheet was with a Swiss-knife.

    Any BeoOwner who takes a Swiss-knife to his BeoGram should be well, you know....

    I wonder if any vintage BeoEngineer could be more specific as to the original material.

    Menahem

    Learn from the mistakes of others - you'll not live long enough to make them all yourself!

  • 02-07-2012 10:02 AM In reply to

    • chartz
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    Re: Replacement dust covers for Tangential BG400x, BG6000 series - economic feasibility

    Yes, interesting.

    Well I managed to polish my Beogram 4000/4002, Beocord 5000 lids quite effectively and they look nice and shiny again with the same techniques I used for the 5005. Only, they will not recover full transparency; there is a slight haze that can't be completely gotten rid of.

    That said, Menahem, this is a great project. However the metal strip issue will have to be sorted indeed.

    I'm looking forward to seing your prototype!

    To me it's not plexiglass because acetone will melt it, unlike for instance my A77 cover which is plexiglass (which can't be moulded to square shapes) So perspex it is not, but polycarbonate it might be!

    Jacques

  • 02-07-2012 10:12 AM In reply to

    Re: Replacement dust covers for Tangential BG400x, BG6000 series - economic feasibility

    chartz:

    Well I managed to polish my Beogram 4000/4002, Beocord 5000 lids quite effectively and they look nice and shiny again with the same techniques I used for the 5005. Only, they will not recover full transparency; there is a slight haze that can't be completely gotten rid of.

     

    I want that "as new" transparency which can be achieved on Beogram 7000 covers but not on the older series. The "slight haze" is what upsets me as does the time that it takes to achieve even this.

    Excellent finish on your lid Jaques. How many hours??

    Regards Graham

  • 02-07-2012 4:18 PM In reply to

    Re: Replacement dust covers for Tangential BG400x, BG6000 series - economic feasibility

    Excellent Jaques, great job you did! Tell us more and how many hours did you spend and how?Smile

    @Menahem, shall I ask my supplier how much it would cost to make a replica of this 4002 cover?

    But then I have to look for oneHmm

    B&O item 1, B&O item 2, B&O item 3,...................B&O item 735

    Beovirus? What's that?

  • 02-08-2012 7:20 AM In reply to

    • chartz
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    Re: Replacement dust covers for Tangential BG400x, BG6000 series - economic feasibility

    Well, basically loads of Brasso (in France, you can't find it, we have Henkel's "Miror") to erase the scratches, then a product called Restom PAP 5000, then car polish with a little wax for transparency.

    I use non-abrasive duster cloth.

    Let's say, well, 4 hours in all. 

    Oh, one last product, lots of elbow grease!

    Jacques

  • 02-08-2012 4:10 PM In reply to

    Re: Replacement dust covers for Tangential BG400x, BG6000 series - economic feasibility

    chartz:

    Oh, one last product, lots of elbow grease!

    Yeah, rightBig Smile

    But I suppose you could do it using a polishing machine?

    B&O item 1, B&O item 2, B&O item 3,...................B&O item 735

    Beovirus? What's that?

  • 02-08-2012 5:53 PM In reply to

    • mdymczyk
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    • Joined on 05-19-2010
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    Re: Replacement dust covers for Tangential BG400x, BG6000 series - economic feasibility

    From my experience it seems that one need a lot of experience to use machine polishing to avoid two problems:

    1) Overheating and in consequence melting the plastic

    2) Making it uneven because of high speed

  • 02-08-2012 6:11 PM In reply to

    Re: Replacement dust covers for Tangential BG400x, BG6000 series - economic feasibility

    mdymczyk:

    From my experience it seems that one need a lot of experience to use machine polishing to avoid two problems:

    1) Overheating and in consequence melting the plastic

    2) Making it uneven because of high speed

    Ah okay, never thought of that...

    B&O item 1, B&O item 2, B&O item 3,...................B&O item 735

    Beovirus? What's that?

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