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Latest post 12-25-2011 7:05 PM by Bentleyman. 27 replies.
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  • 06-26-2011 12:54 PM

    Saab on the brink

    Remember this Christmas Saab?

    Well no sooner than I got sent the new brochure last week for the all new version with wheels (Saab 9-5 Estate), it transpires that all production has stopped and the employees have not been paid!

    They might turn it around yet, but those 9-5 estates might be the last and rarest Saabs of all. Sad

    Graham

    I used to be indecisive, now I'm not so sure. [W C Fields]

  • 06-26-2011 6:42 PM In reply to

    Re: Saab on the brink

    This may sound harsh Graham, but IMHO the world has spoken... Most people do not want a SAAB, and to me, all this about saving the company is sort of keeping a braindead alive. Miracles (business wise) has happened before, but I'm not sure there's one around the corner for SAAB.

     

    :( 

    -Andreas

     

    BLab5, BLab5000, BLab8000, BV10, BS9000, BS3, Beo5, Beo4, BLink1000, BLink5000, BLink7000, A2, A8, Form2

     

     

     

  • 06-27-2011 12:44 AM In reply to

    • mediabobny
    • Top 200 Contributor
    • Joined on 04-19-2007
    • Greenwich Village, NYC
    • Posts 336
    • Founder

    Re: Saab on the brink

    #3 on the list of Brands that won't be around in 2012.

  • 06-27-2011 4:40 AM In reply to

    Re: Saab on the brink

    mediabobny:

    #3 on the list of Brands that won't be around in 2012.

    Nokia is also on that list. Surprise

    -Andreas

     

    BLab5, BLab5000, BLab8000, BV10, BS9000, BS3, Beo5, Beo4, BLink1000, BLink5000, BLink7000, A2, A8, Form2

     

     

     

  • 06-27-2011 6:01 AM In reply to

    Re: Saab on the brink

    Update. The fat lady hasn't sung yet.

     

    EDIT Some good points in the comments on that blog. Why, for example, don't all the investors allegedly waiting for approval for their involvement....... why don't they just place orders for cars?

    I have to say that the order mentioned in this update might pay the bills for a month, but it's neither here nor there compared to the numbers of Saabs sold per month last year, or the numbers that they need to sell to be viable.

    I take your point Andreas, but the allegedly similar GM cars  of Opel and Vauxhall seem to be selling well so I think with Saab it's not the model itself but a sudden lack of confidence in the market that they are going to be around.. it's become a self fulfilling prediction.

    I used to be indecisive, now I'm not so sure. [W C Fields]

  • 06-28-2011 12:21 PM In reply to

    Re: Saab on the brink

    Another deal done. There's still hope!

    Here's how it was in 1959. Watch the return trip right at the end of the film!

    (Link found on the SaabsUnited website).

     

    Graham

    I used to be indecisive, now I'm not so sure. [W C Fields]

  • 06-29-2011 4:40 AM In reply to

    Re: Saab on the brink

    I have seen saab cars for sale in tesco.

    Buy one get one free,brochure not included Devil

  • 06-30-2011 8:59 AM In reply to

    Re: Saab on the brink

    Salaries paid. Production to restart.

     

    Glen fizzawizz:
    I have seen saab cars for sale in tesco.

    Buy two, get a BMW free?

    The next Saab models will have BMW engines: extending a long tradition at Saab of using the best engines available dating back to the Ford Taunus V4.

    My 9-5 has the best diesel unit on the market: supplied by Fiat.

    Bit like B&O: it buys the best displays etc for its TVs. B&O in turn make the best amplifiers and supply everyone else.

    I used to be indecisive, now I'm not so sure. [W C Fields]

  • 06-30-2011 9:43 AM In reply to

    Re: Saab on the brink

    FWIW...

    Another Swedish stalwart has been sold again... Hasselblad

    This time going from Asian ownership to European!

    • B&o bottle opener
  • 06-30-2011 11:53 AM In reply to

    Re: Saab on the brink

    burantek:

    FWIW...

    Another Swedish stalwart has been sold again... Hasselblad

    This time going from Asian ownership to European!

    Hope it works out for them and that the new owner is not an asset stripping hedge fund operation!

    I used to be indecisive, now I'm not so sure. [W C Fields]

  • 06-30-2011 2:21 PM In reply to

    Re: Saab on the brink

    Glen fizzawizz:

    I have seen saab cars for sale in tesco.

    Buy one get one free,brochure not included Devil

    Hi Glen, this must be the very pair!

    Graham

    I used to be indecisive, now I'm not so sure. [W C Fields]

  • 07-01-2011 12:31 PM In reply to

    Re: Saab on the brink

    vikinger:

    Hi Glen, this must be the very pair!

    Graham

    LaughingLaughingLaughing

    I might just have a bid on them Unsure

  • 07-01-2011 7:07 PM In reply to

    • Stan
    • Top 150 Contributor
    • Joined on 04-17-2007
    • Posts 593
    • Gold Member

    Re: Saab on the brink

    I swallowed hard, took a chance and bought a 2010 9-5 Aero this past February.  The car is awesome.  I get complements on it all the time ("Saab?!?  I thought they went out of business!").  I hope Saab can get their act together so you can get your Estate (and I can get my 3 yrs of free maintenance, and many years of paid maintenance afterwards).  This next gen 9-5 is a fine auto.  I knew Saab going under was a possibility at the time I bought, but how else can one reward a little company that does things differently in this world a sameness.

    Stan

  • 07-03-2011 6:25 AM In reply to

    Re: Saab on the brink

    Personally, i think that once gm got there hands into saab that was the beginning of the end for me!!  Saabs were quirky, different and the buyers were very faithful.  In the gm era they were just rebodied opel models!  

  • 07-03-2011 7:49 PM In reply to

    Re: Saab on the brink

    To be honest, what's so "different" about SAAB today compared to others?

     

    Enlighten me.  

    -Andreas

     

    BLab5, BLab5000, BLab8000, BV10, BS9000, BS3, Beo5, Beo4, BLink1000, BLink5000, BLink7000, A2, A8, Form2

     

     

     

  • 07-05-2011 2:36 PM In reply to

    • Stan
    • Top 150 Contributor
    • Joined on 04-17-2007
    • Posts 593
    • Gold Member

    Re: Saab on the brink

    For me, at least, their most important difference is that I actually fit comfortably within.  I'm 6'4'', but have relatively short legs (hence, long torso), and I do not fit in any Lexus (and many other Japanese makes), or the smaller German imports (A4, BM3-series - didn't bother with the MB, even the 5 series and A6 are tight).  I have enough headroom in a 9-3 and 9-5 (old and new generation).

    Saab's are a great combination of praticality, performance and safety.  They have some of the most comfortable seats (my current Aero seats are most comfortable I've sat in).  They usually have more useable luggage and cabin space than other similarly sized cars (at least any I've compared).  Their rear seats fold flat so you get a nice flat cargo space - I was able to carry my son's upright bass (and me and my son) in my old 9-5 - it did not fit in a much larger Camry (on loan from the dealer because the door fell off my Toyota mini-van).  They get good mileage for their peppy performance.  The turbos are not the fastest from 0-60 (who cares,  I don't race from stoplights), but from 40-80 they scream (exactly where you need the power to pass on two lane highways, or merge onto a crowded highway).  Their safety record speaks for itself.  Yes, there are other cars that do well on the crash tests, but Saabs do better in real life (look at insurance industry records).

    They are great in the snow.  Front wheel drive is better in the snow than rear-wheel without the added cost, weight and complexity of 4 wheel drive.  Audi sells FWD, but they are impossible to find at dealers in the US as "everybody" wants 4wd.

    The new 9-5 has a turning radius almost 1 ft less than the Buick LaCross which is built on the same platform.  This allows the big car to feel much smaller, and makes it easier to manuver in tight spaces.  Why didn't GM do this?

    They elevated the cup holder to a functional piece of sculpture (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yMxsf7PA95E)

    Unfortunately for Saab, most of these "features" are not noticed in a short test drive.  With the internet, people do a lot of "paper research" and compare specs (0-60, interior room, mpg), but don't understand that these specs are not all equal (I'm sure the Camry that couldn't hold the bass had more spec'd cargo space than my 9-5)... and car buyers seem prefer one-dimensional thinking (I want the best performance OR the best economy OR the best safety -  I think stats show Saab is best in safety, at least some years, but Volvo has done a much better job with the marketing on this front) rather than multi-dimensional analysis (I want the best combination of performance, economy and safety - and this is a hard story to market).

    Oh yeah, I do think the new 9-5 is a gorgeous car that is not easy to mistake for any other car out there today - and there are not many cars that you can say this about anymore.

    Finally, they're the underdog, and they have a history of innovation (heated seats, turbos, air conditioned seats, active head restraints) so maybe they'll innovate something clever in the future.

    Does the world really need this brand?  No.  Is the automotive world more interesting because of them?  I think so.

    Stan

  • 07-06-2011 9:18 AM In reply to

    Re: Saab on the brink

    All great brands deserve to have fans that are as passionate and as eloquent as you !

     

    Being picky ..... but ...

    Stan:
    Their safety record speaks for itself.  Yes, there are other cars that do well on the crash tests, but Saabs do better in real life (look at insurance industry records)

    ... might not be the cars, it might be the drivers that are attracted to the cars ...

    First B&O (1976) was a Beogram 1500 ... latest (2011) change has been to couple the BL11 with the BL6Ks *sounds superb*

  • 07-16-2011 10:27 AM In reply to

    Re: Saab on the brink

    bayerische:

    To be honest, what's so "different" about SAAB today compared to others?

     

    Enlighten me.  

    Hi Andreas,

    Not a great deal to add to Stan's response.

    Saab were very different once: my Saab 96 was very distinctive in appearance, had a sporting performance, and that great freewheel device that caught everyone out who had just moved from a conventional car to Saab. (Clutchless gearchanging, but don't expect anything when you mistakenly think you've just changed down for downhill braking!)

    My current 9-5 Sportwagon Anniversary  estate has the capacity of a furniture van and, as Stan says, very very comfortable seats. It also has fabulous front wheel drive (which got me off an icy car park a couple of years ago when a friend had to abandon his rear wheel Jaguar XF.) BMW have spent years of advertising trying to make-out that rear wheel drive was superior and so many have fallen for that line..... but it just isn't true for wet or icy conditions.

    The cars currently share a floor pan with Opel/ Vauxhall models and that has led many to think that the Saab models are just a bit of badge engineering. Nothing could be further from the truth. For 20+years Saab has shared floor pans with other makes like Lancia and Fiat and it didn't result in unwarranted disparaging reviews. They've also always picked the best of engines from other makers (even under General Motors ownership).

    And..... on the safety front, since the Saab 96 of 1970 (which actually had a column change) they've always locked the gearstick for security rather than the steering wheel (allegedly after some unexpected steering-in-motion-lock-ups with other non-Saab cars.)

    If Saab don't survive there's undoubtedly plenty to choose from. Bit like B&O. Whistle

    Graham

    I used to be indecisive, now I'm not so sure. [W C Fields]

  • 07-27-2011 5:08 PM In reply to

    • Stan
    • Top 150 Contributor
    • Joined on 04-17-2007
    • Posts 593
    • Gold Member

    Re: Saab on the brink

    elephant:

    All great brands deserve to have fans that are as passionate and as eloquent as you !

     

    Being picky ..... but ...

    Stan:
    Their safety record speaks for itself.  Yes, there are other cars that do well on the crash tests, but Saabs do better in real life (look at insurance industry records)

    ... might not be the cars, it might be the drivers that are attracted to the cars ...

    Good point.  Quite possible we are self selecting safe drivers. 

    I was also just reading that Volvo is looking for a new direction for their brand because "safety is now a given".  "Everybody does it", and when every car has 10 airbags, does adding 10 more really excite anyone.  Maybe it's a good thing Saab never grabbed on to the safety branding...  Although, I think some of this goes back to my comments about the weight of paper evaluations - the article hinted that one can compare safety by counting the number of airbags...

    Makes me wonder - this winter, 2 local teens were killed when their car (a Korean make) hit some ice, slid sideways into a tree and split in 1/2 (no drinking involved and both were wearing seat belts).  I'm willing to bet, regardless of number of airbags, those kids would have faired better in a Saab.  My son is almost driving age... I'd like to have him drive a Saab, but I'd have to buy a 1999 model to find one that isn't a turbo... regardless of the safety of the car, I'm doubtful that a 16 yr old + turbo is a safe mix...

     

     

  • 08-20-2011 5:20 PM In reply to

    • Lagom
    • Not Ranked
    • Joined on 04-18-2007
    • New Orleans
    • Posts 35
    • Bronze Member

    Re: Saab on the brink

    What I liked about SAAB was the clever engineering.  The rear hatch on my 1994 900SE had a handle where you pulled it towards you to close.  The door was perfectly weighted and closed without touching the outside, which was often dirty.  On my model, the rear defrost came on automatically too.  The outside mirrors allowed the driver to see in the blindspots through an extended region on the mirrors.  (Not aware of any other car sold in the US that had this feature.)  Though I never used this next function for its intended purpose, but I had a lot of fun using it on other drivers: the security locks in the doors.  Twisting the key in the outside door lock engaged a secondary lock that could only be turned off from the door that activated the system.  This was most fun when done from the passenger door because all door plugs are raised and the doors are still locked.  It took a long time for someone to figure out what was happening.

  • 09-08-2011 4:26 PM In reply to

    Re: Saab on the brink

    Looks seriously bad for SAAB right now...

    -Andreas

     

    BLab5, BLab5000, BLab8000, BV10, BS9000, BS3, Beo5, Beo4, BLink1000, BLink5000, BLink7000, A2, A8, Form2

     

     

     

  • 12-19-2011 9:23 AM In reply to

    Re: Saab on the brink

    And today it happened.

     

     

    -Andreas

     

    BLab5, BLab5000, BLab8000, BV10, BS9000, BS3, Beo5, Beo4, BLink1000, BLink5000, BLink7000, A2, A8, Form2

     

     

     

  • 12-19-2011 7:24 PM In reply to

    • Chris
    • Top 500 Contributor
      Male
    • Joined on 05-09-2010
    • Last of the Summer Wine Country, Yorkshire, UK
    • Posts 195
    • Gold Member

    Re: Saab on the brink

    Rest in Peace Saab - the very best of luck to all employees concerned and for the fans of Saab.

     

     

    Beosound 8, Beotalk 1100, Beocom 4, A8 Headphones, Form 2 Headphones, Apple iPhone 4S, iPod Classic, iPad 1, Sky+ HD, Sony Playstation 3, Jacob Jensen T10, Lutron Rania IR Dual Dimmer/ Accesory dimmer, B+O A9 Keyring (SOLD), Beolit 600 (SOLD), Apple Airport Express, Beo5

  • 12-19-2011 11:04 PM In reply to

    Re: Saab on the brink

    Sorry to hear this, the SAAB 96 was the best winter car I ever drove.

    Beosound 3000, BL 4000, BL 8000, BG 2404,BG 5000, BG CD50, Beocord 5000, BM 901, BM 2400, BM 4000, BV S45, BV 3702. There is nothing we cannot do, but a lot of things we don't want to do!!

  • 12-21-2011 3:51 AM In reply to

    Re: Saab on the brink

    The fat lady is singing.

    Great company caught between being a low volume niche market producer and being a GM subsidiary.

    Museum

    Happy Christmas!

    Here's hoping someone buys them  out of bankruptcy........... but it's more likely that the name will live on after a new start.......... that will take 2 years +

    I used to be indecisive, now I'm not so sure. [W C Fields]

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