Picking up on Peter's mention of critical members I believe he is very right in supporting that. I have been very critical and still am over my two periods of ownership which have lasted since 1982 and intend to continue.

B&O ownership (IMHO) is a balance of sound quality (or video) and design. Most of the Audiophile press discount the design completely and concentrate solely on sound quality and to such people B&O is over-priced moderate Hi-fi (there are exceptions The Beolab5's perhaps?). To me the design is very important --given the limits of the human ear I would rather have a nice balance between the two and I am prepared to pay for it when I can afford it. This leads me to the love hate relationship I have with this product!

I am prepared to pay their prices to an extent and recently they have begun to grate a little. My favourite subject is launching tv sets without digital tuners at the price they are asking. It strikes me that the exploitation is getting a bit rediculous. Having paid nigh on £4000 for a 26inch lcd they want to charge about £500 for a digital tuner upgrade!!!!!!!!!! They may think its good for their profits but I have doubts. Launching a DVD2 with an analogue Tuner is still staggering me. Can any one explain?

 The second and important element is the design. Is it me or has B&O lost its design edge. One of the reasons why I am buying Lee's F1000 is because of the sheer strength of the design. I may buy from him a pearly black DVD1 to sit nicely on top and avoid the DVD2 (note the word may I am still struggling with this)

As you can see from my signature I am a committed B&O owner over a fair period of time but I have never had a love love relationship with them. Its always been a love hate relationship.

Hope you all don't mind.

 

 

 

 

Hi Barry,

I think, and hope we all have that kind of relationship with B&O... None of us can ignore some big faults in the design of our beloved products, it turns me crazy that I cannot adjust the volume of my tvs when my Beo4 is out of battery....But, the stuff is so beautiful I can live with that.

What gets the most on my nerves is more the behavior of certain B&O dealers, who are so confident in the products that they offer a very poor, if some, service....

Cheers,

Laurent.

Thats a very interesting and rational post, and i really do agree that there is something very wrong with some of these products price-tags.  A 4000 pound TV from the company that has built such a strong reputation and very high expectations from the consumers, should at least have the basic necessary features. I don't know anyone who would disagree with that. I mean, 500 pounds for a digital tuner? C'mon give me a break!

I agree with you in the main. A couple of points:

The DVD2 I cannot defend - it is a rebadged Philips designed to provide a product that B&O don't offer. I have no idea why they chose one without a digital tuner as it has no easy facility to use an external tuner.

The Digital tuner in TV I can defend a bit better. As long as my TV can fully utilise an external digital tuner and integrate with it very well, I would rather have that. As with flat screen TV, the game is moving on all the time and present day digital tuners will be obsolete pretty soon. If you have the ability to change the tuner cheaply but keep the TV, it seems like a good idea. Come mpeg4, as seen in some Eastern European countries already, and B&O will be laughing. Except those poor people who bought the DVB-T to fit in the set for £500! I feel this has been introduced as a result of customer demand and shows that the customer is not always right. An external box controlled by a STB-C seems to me to be the way forward until the technology has stopped changing. I see a lot of other make TV owners being pretty cheesed off when the wonderful digital tuner is rendered out of date. 

I agree with almost all that has been said, however I would point out Peter that I believe you will find in the future that the DVB-T will have a software upgrade to support MPEG4, now before you say it, I agree we may have to wait a long time for that software upgrade to arrive as I had to wait to get the software update to allow digital text (BBCi) to work.

As a measure of how fast things change. Guess why this chart stops in May?

With the introduction of the Playstation 3, Blu-ray got a boost, but HD-DVD is not only catching up, according to Toshiba it's shot past in the summer months ... This is Sony's chart at CEDIA, cleverly terminated while Blu-ray was still ahead.

I agree with Peter. Have never understood this need to have tuners, etc., built in when the separate tuner gives you modular flexibility and state-of-the-art a lot more easily. I'd rather question some of the connection issues that B&O present us with. 

Peter,

The argument regarding the separate tuner is in some ways effective (enough to convince me at the time of the purchase of my 6-26) but is unsustainable on sales and design terms. When the great switchover comes is B&O going to sell TV's without any tuner? Is it going to say that whilst you have bought this gorgeous piece of design pop down the road and hang a Thompson on the end of it. We will give you a bit of wire to solve the remote problem!!!!!!!!!!!

This is the logic of the argument. If they supplied their own design related tuner but gave you the opportunity to choose another then that might (and only might) just work but in marketing terms the whole approach is a disaster.

 

 

Actually I would suggest that a B&O branded external box would be a good idea. I actually use a Sky box all the time and one cannot get any TV with this built in to my knowledge. DVB-T gives far too much break up in my area though I do have a DVD-R with a built in digital tuner. It would allow the customer to have real choice. Maybe an empty shell with the connections set up to accept either satellite, DVB-T or cable boxes. I am however happy with the situation though I do understand the disquiet at a lack of the digital tuner. I am sure that its provision is designed to deal with this. No doubt a good percentage will continue to use Sky in the UK at least.

It is rather unlikely that a software upgrade will make the tuner H.264 compatible although I haven't looked to see what processor is used to be sure. The decoding is done in hardware and a MPEG-2 decoder would not have the capability to decode H.264. Anyhow, with 8M MPEG-2 boxes out there - the switch to H.264 will likely take a very long time as the government are keen to switch off the analog frequencies and confusing the population with WHAT digital decoder type they need would be crazy - although I note that Sky are talking of launching a H.264 box which will handle their 3 pay channels (It's in consultation right now whether they will be allowed). If Sky get their way, then a new board would be needed (plus videoguard ca support)