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This is the first Archived Forum which was active between 17th April 2007 and 1st March February 2012

 

Latest post 11-16-2011 5:22 AM by moxxey. 14 replies.
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  • 11-11-2011 3:56 AM

    • jondhm
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    Beosound 4 sound quality

    Hi folks

    My Beomaster 5000 (bought new in 1984!) and CD 50 (c1986) have finally died, and I've just bought myself a new Beosound 4.  About 12 years ago the baffles in my RL60 speakers fell to bits, and I bought a couple of Beolab 6000 speakers - incidentally at the time the dealers told me I couldn't drive them from a Beomaster 5000, but I checked the outputs from the phono sockets and contacted B&O in Denmark, who confirmed it would work.  The sound quality was brilliant, and I used the old RL60s (with the baffles removed) as rear speakers to give a really rich sound.

    So, now I have a Beosound 4 driving my two old Beolab 6000s via my existing phono cabes via an adaptor cable I have made up terminating in a 5-pin DIN plug for the Powerlink socket. I also bought a pair of Beolab 4s to use as rear speakers, driven from the second Powerlink socket so I can disconnect them easily.  I have also built myself a fader control fro the Beolab 4s, but that's another story!

    It all works, and DAB radio is brilliant.  BUT - I am disappointed in the sound quality particularly on CD (haven't tried the SD card yet - one step at a time).  I have lost the really high frequencies which give the real feeling of presence, and which my old system gave me.  It all sounds a bit muffled and boring, the quality being what I could have got from a £300 setup.  The bass is a bit lacking, but that would be me missing my old RL60s, and I'm not quite ready to go for a subwoofer.  The main speakers are the same, the cabling (apart from the adaptors) is the same, so is the problem with my Beosound 4?  The threads I have looked at would indicate that the Beosound 4 gives high quality sound particularly on CD.

    So - should I upgrade to proper Powerlink cables, or indeed Sounds Heavenly cables, or do I need talk again to my dealer about my particular Beosound 4?  Could it be out of specification, or am I expecting too much? Any other suggestions would be really appreciated.  Incidentally, I have run trials both with and without the Beolab 4s in case I was getting a capacitance effect with the additional cabling.

    Many thanks

     

     

  • 11-11-2011 5:40 AM In reply to

    Re: Beosound 4 sound quality

    You may be just too used to the sound of the CD50. It's quite different to most other (even B&O) CD players. Some people like it, some don't. Give your ears a bit of time to readjust - the BS4 is probably closer to "truth", if there is such a thing in audio.

    I don't believe the speaker cables would make much (or any) difference... but since you have now Powerlink devices at both ends of the cable, I'd convert to PL cables anyway to get proper on/off switching.

    -mika

  • 11-11-2011 12:10 PM In reply to

    • jondhm
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    Re: Beosound 4 sound quality

    Thanks for the comment - which is reassuring.  In the short term I am playing around with the bass / treble / loudness, and also with the position switches on the Beolab 4s.  At present my cables all run under the carpet, so I'll plan to stick with my old cabling until I either move house or change / lift the carpet.

  • 11-11-2011 12:55 PM In reply to

    • rfc1
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    Re: Beosound 4 sound quality

    Interesting topic, i have just bought a beosound 4 , and have been used to Beosystem 6500 as a source .  I will update once i have used  it for some time.

     

    sandy

  • 11-11-2011 6:22 PM In reply to

    • Medogsfat
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    Re: Beosound 4 sound quality

    In fairness Beolab4's & Beolab 6000's aren't the greatest speakers in the world as far as bass is concerned, the mellow qualities of the CD50 combined with one of B&O's better amps probably covered this up over the years. Mika is quite right that you have probably become accustomed to this & that your ears need to re-educate themselves to the harsher/clinical realities of modern systems.

    Am I right in thinking that you have 2 sets of speakers (BL6000's & BL4's) connected to your Beosond 4 in an audio only set up?

    Do you still have the Beomaster 5000, CD50 & RL 60's? Don't bin them, they are all repairable and much better than what you have at present.

    Chris.

    The use of metaphors should be avoided like the plague. They're like a red rag to a bull to me.

  • 11-11-2011 7:31 PM In reply to

    Re: Beosound 4 sound quality

    The BeoMaster 5000 is the most beautiful B&O ever   I still have the 1984 catalogue that i read as a shorty!

  • 11-12-2011 12:48 PM In reply to

    • SWISS_2
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    • Neuchatel, Suisse
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    Re: Beosound 4 sound quality

    I think it may be your speaker choice.

    When I graduated from a BS 3200 to our new Beosound 4 one year ago this month, I first connected it to a set of Beolab 4 speakers, using powerlink. It was nice, but I was not impressed with the overall sound, with the speakers on BL3/BL 4 stands, on granite, and ceiling mounted. They then became rear speakers.

    Connecting further to Beolab 2000 ML-linked upstairs and in other rooms actually produced a little better sound. And we found we could option to a different program using the BL2000 and Beosound 4 in linked rooms. Very nice.

    However connecting to Beolab 4000 produced the best results: Good strong music and radio, and an overall better, more distinct sound. The bass in this speaker is superior to the Beolab 6000, so this is perhaps why. I have since placed both BL 4000 on either side of the Beosound 4 as our prime HTPC speakers.

    On another aspect regarding playback sound on the BS 4 is the music source itself.  We listened to the same music (4 different recordings: 2 downloads, and 2 CD albums) on using 5 music sources. BS4 CD, PC CD, N. MUSIC, SD card, and Media Centre.

    To our ears, the BS 4 produces the best music using the SD card. Distinct, clear, and well balanced. Recorded CD music or dowloads came in second using Media Centre, which we thought would have been from the actual CD itself.

    So the majority of the time we listen to SD card music, recorded from the PC, and controlled throughout the house using a Beo 4 remote. Unlike the BS 3200, the Beosound 4 is rarely touched, except to insert or remove SD cards now and then.

  • 11-13-2011 4:24 AM In reply to

    • jondhm
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    Re: Beosound 4 sound quality

    Thank you all for your comments and responses.  These are really most helpful.  I am going to follow up the suggestions made, particularly the low cost ones in the short term, and see how I get on.

    This is my first foray into Beoworld even though I have been a B&O owner since 1984, and I am really encouraged by the responses.  One side effect is that I now plan to upgrade to Bronze membership and will sell my old Beo 5000 equipment through the site rather than eBay.

     

  • 11-13-2011 4:35 AM In reply to

    • jondhm
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    Re: Beosound 4 sound quality

    Chris

     

    Yes, I do have two sets of speakers: My old Beolab 6000s in front and my new Beolab 4s at the rear.  All connected by phono screened leads, with adaptors to 5-pin DIN plugs into the two Powerlink sockets.  Beolab 4s via a homemade fader (a variable resistor in series) because of the room layout

    I've just read your comment about my old equipment.  I do still have it, plus the related cassette and record decks and manuals.  I decided to upgrade mainly because the amp failed - last year the CD player failed but I spent 4 hours carefully cleaning and lubricating all the obvious bits inside, and got it working again.  I probably will sell it all, because I have now bought the Beosound and Beolab 4s, and these is a limit to the old equipment that my wife tolerates!  She has to put up with a 1973 Triumph GT6 in the garage which I bought in 1976.

  • 11-13-2011 6:34 AM In reply to

    • moxxey
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    Re: Beosound 4 sound quality

    jondhm:

    It all works, and DAB radio is brilliant.  BUT - I am disappointed in the sound quality particularly on CD (haven't tried the SD card yet - one step at a time).  I have lost the really high frequencies which give the real feeling of presence, and which my old system gave me.  It all sounds a bit muffled and boring

    CD fans won't like this, but I struggle to listen to CDs on my BS4. They are, as you say, too mid-range, too boring, too muffled.

    Rip the CD to iTunes lossless, then play the tracks with some equalisation and the results are superb. I was listening to the Hurts album (on CD) yesterday and had to switch to my ripped version and the quality appear far higher. So much for poor DAC on the Airport Express. I simply can't listen to most CDs directly from my BS4.

    In fact, I could eliminate the BS4 and connect the BL3s directly to the Airport Express. Of course, I wouldn't. I do like the design and build of my BS4.

  • 11-14-2011 11:46 AM In reply to

    Re: Beosound 4 sound quality

    Very interesting observations - I too find the SD card music stunning.

    I too came from the BM5000 and CD50 route to the BS4 and BL6000; even having RL 6000s at one stage ... I do not recall having the same sense of disappointment you have.

    Just a suggestion, move the BL 6000s to where thet can be driven directly by the BS4 through a pure Powerlink cable connection and see what a difference that makes - just to see if there is anything in the hypothesis that the old cable arrangement is incorrect.

    Remember to flick the switch on the BL 6000s from LINE to L and R respectively.

    First B&O (1976) was a Beogram 1500 ... latest (2011) change has been to couple the BL11 with the BL6Ks *sounds superb*

  • 11-14-2011 12:27 PM In reply to

    Re: Beosound 4 sound quality

    elephant:
    Remember to flick the switch on the BL 6000s from LINE to L and R respectively.

    Just gas a thought (I am no electronics/electical engineer), but perhaps that switch needs to be simple reset from your original set-up ?

    Take a look at the subtle differenes between an AUX connection and a PL connection as shown here http://www.beoworld.org/beotech/misc2.htm

    The more I think about this, the more I think the issue is that there is no simple swap in and out of the BS4 PL output for a BM 5000 PHONO output

    First B&O (1976) was a Beogram 1500 ... latest (2011) change has been to couple the BL11 with the BL6Ks *sounds superb*

  • 11-16-2011 2:57 AM In reply to

    • jondhm
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    Re: Beosound 4 sound quality

    Thanks for the really useful comments about the sound quality from SD cards.  I have tested this, and it does seem to make a difference.  Which in turn starts to point the finger at the CD player in the Beosound 4 as being the weak link, particularly because I think I get better sound quality from DAB radio.

    All a bit subjective, and, as one of the earlier respondents said, I am probably going to get used to the different sound over time.

    I now need to run some tests on the optimum bitrate to use for rips to SD card.  Lossless is the gold standard, but a CD can need 0.5GB to 0.75GB.  Useful thread at the moment on SD card capacity, and I am glad I have a new Beosoound 4 as that gives me the 8GB limit.  Fortunately my music collection is on CDs rather than downloads so I can choose the bitrate and format.

    Powerlink cabling - I'll keep an eye out for some cabling and will try this at some stage.

     

  • 11-16-2011 4:56 AM In reply to

    Re: Beosound 4 sound quality

    On the same note, I also use my BeoCenter 2 with Pentas, and quickly found out that the same music sounded much better through the Mac Mini, sending the signal to a DAC Magic & going through the AUX in on BC2, rather than the direct feed from the CD.Surprise

    This goes against the "hi-fi logic" that says: the shorter the route, the better the sound. And my case, I'm sure the DAC Magic plays a great part in the sound enhancement (after all, that's why I bought it!).

    Maybe I should play a CD from the Mac Mini & compare it to the BC2's CD player sound, to be completely objective. Idea

    Reunion Island is greeting you!

  • 11-16-2011 5:22 AM In reply to

    • moxxey
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    Re: Beosound 4 sound quality

    Chrisreunion:

    On the same note, I also use my BeoCenter 2 with Pentas, and quickly found out that the same music sounded much better through the Mac Mini, sending the signal to a DAC Magic & going through the AUX in on BC2, rather than the direct feed from the CD.Surprise

    I think we just get used to the dynamic equalisation, then when you go back to modern CDs they sound very flat in comparison! I'm not too impressed with the production of some modern CDs - tracks are often designed to sound best on headphones, so the range is limited and they sound poor on top quality speakers.

    It's now better to buy the CD, rip as high quality as possible and then stream as a digital track.

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