After last weeks modest success discussing the relative merits of "Beatles vs Oasis" I thought we would have another bash at a rumbuctuous debate full of "poking and ribbery" (I made that up but I like the sound of it - I think it should be word).

I did promise Alex we could discuss the merits of Radiohead but, after careful consideration, I decided to fill in for all the oldies and end the argument by concluding they are

       "Enigmatic, Somber, Reflective, Intense, Plaintive, Wistful, Bittersweet, Paranoid, Gloomy, Wintry, Poignant, Aggressive, Theatrical, Eerie, Earnest, Melancholy, Angst-Ridden, Brooding."

and leave Alex to defend their merits.

For the rest of us I thought we could maybe debate the relative importance of English versus American popular music.

Hopefully there are enough online to promote a lively and informative debate

 

Right! Just before you start, a couple of things I'd like to say.
Firstly, I have every intention of being pleasant to you this evening (just)
Secondly, I will try my upmost not to mention my ****** ***** 7000 ******
Thirdly, What's happened to Piercepd? Do you think he is really Paul Potts? Or is he in a huff coz we had a go at his purple font?
Now then, What's tonight's debate about again?

Andy T.

jandyt:

Right! Just before you start, a couple of things I'd like to say.
Firstly, I have every intention of being pleasant to you this evening (just)
Secondly, I will try my upmost not to mention my ****** ***** 7000 ******
Thirdly, What's happened to Piercepd? Do you think he is really Paul Potts? Or is he in a huff coz we had a go at his purple font?
Now then, What's tonight's debate about again?

Andy T.

I'm so glad we've made up!

Slightly off topic (What topic?) but can I just run this by you, you being such an intelligent and knowledgeable chap?
If I could run faster than the speed of light and I were to take a photo' of Pendle Hill then run as quick as I could and stand on Pendle, posing,would I be on the photo'?

Andy T.

Ok, to start off, one of the biggest bands around at the moment are The Killers. I loved the first album (havnt realy got into the second). American band from Las Vegas. So you may think im on the Americans side of the debate......well no, anyone heard of an English band that went by the name of Shed Seven? they were quite popular in England at one time but never made it realy big. The Killers sound just like Shed Seven and admit to being influensed by Shed Seven and The Smiths. This is just one example.

 British popular music is the most influentual music in the world.

 I also think, English v American should actualy be British v American.

jandyt:

Slightly off topic (What topic?) but can I just run this by you, you being such an intelligent and knowledgeable chap?
If I could run faster than the speed of light and I were to take a photo' of Pendle Hill then run as quick as I could and stand on Pendle, posing,would I be on the photo'?

Andy T. 

Good one! - If you could (and according to Albert you can't) then it would depend on how much faster you could run and how far the camera was from the hill (if speed/time/distance relationships were linear - but they're not - my physics teacher told me so! Unless you know different??)

ArgyleMoss:

 I also think, English v American should actualy be British v American.

My deepest apologies my dear Argyle! You are absolutely correct and that is precisely what I meant. (I think I was put off by the Bay City Rollers).

Sorry mate, you're way off. It wouln't depend on any of those factors.
Think about where the light that entered the lens came from and when.

Andy T.

jandyt:

Sorry mate, you're way off. It wouln't depend on any of those factors.
Think about where the light that entered the lens came from and when.

Andy T.

I'm not going to be drawn! - explain!

Sorry Mark, I know very little about popular music, English or American. However I know that an awful lot of pop music is influenced by classical music.

Andy T.

jandyt:

Sorry Mark, I know very little about popular music, English or American. However I know that an awful lot of pop music is influenced by classical music.

Andy T.

Good enough - name as many pop tunes with "nicked" classical riifs as you can.

I'll set the ball rolling with

"Joybringer" - Manfred Mann - Jupiter - Holst.

"Lady Lynda" - Beach Boys - Jesu, Joy of Man's Desiring - Bach

 

Puncher:

jandyt:

Sorry mate, you're way off. It wouln't depend on any of those factors.
Think about where the light that entered the lens came from and when.

Andy T.

I'm not going to be drawn! - explain!

Gosh! You only spent twenty-one minutes thinking about it and you've given up.
Keith Saunders wouldn't be where he is today if he gave up that easily!
Be drawn.

Andy T.

"This night" by Billy Joel---- Beethoven's Pathetyque
"The chicken song" by Spitting Image--- Stravinsky's Patrushka
The Beatles "Because" ---Beethoven Moonlight sonata

Andy T.

Well the Killers are actually more influenced by New Order (even named the band after the New Order spoof group in one of their video's, 'Regret' I think), instrumentation, structure, etc...but I get your point about influence. But to say Britain produces the most influential music in the world is going too far I believe. Hip-hop, RnB and all the levels between rather dominate the world charts; its possible to believe that in sales success alone, Madlib (producer), JayZ, DangerMouse (producer) and Timberland (producer and artist) have had more influence on shaping sound than the last 10 years of British output.

Not really sure if American v English music is something you can discuss as such? That's like comparing Indian food to Chinese, just two very different but very good styles of food/music.

Alex:

Not really sure if American v English music is something you can discuss as such? That's like comparing Indian food to Chinese, just two very different but very good styles of food/music.

I'm sure there is a thread about Elvis, Buddy Holly, Little Richard, Mowtown, Beatles, Stones, Floyd, Velvet Underground, Bowie etc.

Did what we know in the UK as punk originate in the US or UK??

(I must admit most "black" music (no offence intended, came from the US but then again that was the beginning of Elvis, Holly etc.)

I'm interested in peoples impressions of the origin of their favourite genre of music.

 

jandyt:

Sorry mate, you're way off. It wouln't depend on any of those factors.
Think about where the light that entered the lens came from and when.

Andy T.

jandyt:

Sorry mate, you're way off. It wouln't depend on any of those factors.
Think about where the light that entered the lens came from and when.

Andy T.

Just to throw a spanner in the works - the speed of light is a bit of a myth. Scientists have actually slowed it down to less than 30 mph at near to absolute zero temparatures so all you'd really need is some very good thermals.

Right - back to the thread.

There are very few American artsits who can really be classed as globally influential.

Bob Dylan, The Velvet Underground are a couple who spring to mind.

The majority of them spew out the same old mid Atlantic light rock which is great for insomniacs.

British music on the other hand has always stood apart by its constant refusal to pander to the masses simply to shift shed loads of records. The beauty is that the best of these artists actually achieve the sales because of this non-conformist attitude. Dare I add that the British public have a more sophisticated musical pallet than our stateside cousins?

 

Chris.

Interesting thoughts Chris

jandyt:

Interesting thoughts Chris

 

Elvis "It's now or never"--- O Sole Mio, Capua

jandyt:

Interesting thoughts Chris

Hmmm.... dunno what happened there Andy. Anyway my text has now appeared if you'r care to have another look - get yerself some nice thick woolies and let me know how you get on.

Since I'm being nice to you tonight, I'll put you out of your misery.
First you have to pose on Pendle then run faster than the speed of light therefore overtaking the light reflected of your person. Turn round quick and take the photo'.
If you ran a bit too quick you might have to wait a little while before pressing the shutter.

Andy T.

jandyt:

Since I'm being nice to you tonight, I'll put you out of your misery.
First you have to pose on Pendle then run faster than the speed of light therefore overtaking the light reflected of your person. Turn round quick and take the photo'.
If you ran a bit too quick you might have to wait a little while before pressing the shutter.

Andy T.

Of course you're right (sort of) - if you could run faster then distance/difference in speed doesn't matter but you can't!

On a similar thread, just how many Turtles are there in the stack? And if there are an infinite number of Turtles how come there's room for us??