in Search
Latest post 07-04-2007 5:26 PM by Friedmett. 17 replies.
Page 1 of 1 (18 items)
Sort Posts: Previous Next
  • 04-16-2007 6:46 PM

    • duke46
    • Not Ranked
    • Joined on 04-16-2007
    • Posts 8
    • Bronze Member

    Best Cartridge??

    Hi there,

    I have 2 working 3400 turntables that as I read they were made to play quad CD-4 LP's. They both have MMC 20EN carts and have read where the 20CL is an upgrade? I just play quad lp's on these units and if I ever have to replace the cartridge for either one or find a good buy I just wanted to make sure I get what I need if any one can help. One of mine needs the plastic cover over the stylus because it, I guess glues on and had been knocked off and lost. Have not found one yet to replace it but keep trying. I just hope I don't ever hit the stylus by mistake.

    Take any help or advice I can get. I love the sound these units put out.

    Thanks

    Duke in NC

  • 04-17-2007 12:52 AM In reply to

    • Kevin
    • Top 50 Contributor
    • Joined on 02-15-2007
    • Moderator
    • Posts 1,256
    • Founder

    Re: Best Cartridge??

    Not sure as to Quad but the CL makes quite a difference on my BG4000 a fresher sound altogether.

    As to replacements, even new old stock which do come up occasionaly are old and the supension must have hardened to some extent.

    Soundsmith do these cartridges and all reports we had on the old forum were they were very good. 

  • 04-17-2007 3:01 AM In reply to

    Re: Best Cartridge??

    The 3400 was designed to use the MMC5000 cartridge. I am surprised that the EN copes with the tracking or the rear channels in CD4 records. The CL certainly can though, as Kevin says, the suspensions will harden and this ability reduces. Having tried a number of cartridges with Quad records, my CLs did the best but I have not tried a suitable Soundsmith. I do now have a Soundsmith SMMC20EN but my deck is in France! The CL was definitely better than the 5000s and 6000s I had!
  • 04-17-2007 9:55 AM In reply to

    • duke46
    • Not Ranked
    • Joined on 04-16-2007
    • Posts 8
    • Bronze Member

    Re: Best Cartridge??

    Thanks for the responses.

    My units came with the MMC20EN. This was a rename of the MMC4000. I am guessing mine came after they decided to get away from the CD4 phase. This is what was on I guess this site back in Oct of 05 and on page 2 it gives a lot of info as to what was going on at the time. http://www.beoworld.co.uk/mmcpickups_1.htm This link is no good but maybe it is in here somewhere just need to change its address to find it? It would help a lot. I made a copy of pages 1-3 and I guess that was all that I needed. I have the org paper work that came with my first one along with the MMC20EN test certificate. I am not sure but would guess that the MMC6000 became the MMC20CL. Some times the more you read the more Confused you get!!!!

    Thanks Guys

    Duke

  • 04-18-2007 3:43 AM In reply to

    • Medogsfat
    • Top 10 Contributor
      Male
    • Joined on 02-21-2007
    • *Moderator* Leeds, Yorkshire
    • Posts 4,045
    • Founder

    Re: Best Cartridge??

    All cartridge info is now on this site and can be found here in the accessories section

     

     http://www.beoworld.org/prod_results.asp?cid=6&rid=43

     

    Chris.

    The use of metaphors should be avoided like the plague. They're like a red rag to a bull to me.

  • 04-18-2007 3:50 AM In reply to

    Re: Best Cartridge??

    duke46:

    Thanks for the responses.

    My units came with the MMC20EN. This was a rename of the MMC4000. I am guessing mine came after they decided to get away from the CD4 phase. This is what was on I guess this site back in Oct of 05 and on page 2 it gives a lot of info as to what was going on at the time. http://www.beoworld.co.uk/mmcpickups_1.htm This link is no good but maybe it is in here somewhere just need to change its address to find it? It would help a lot. I made a copy of pages 1-3 and I guess that was all that I needed. I have the org paper work that came with my first one along with the MMC20EN test certificate. I am not sure but would guess that the MMC6000 became the MMC20CL. Some times the more you read the more Confused you get!!!!

    Thanks Guys

    Duke

    The MMC6000 was a lovely cartridge with a Beryllium cantilever and a diamond with a Pramanik profile. The CL used a simplified version of this diamond but on a single crystal sapphire cantilever which was even more rigid. I am planning to try one of the new Soundsmith CLs at some time - when I have the money!!Laughing

  • 04-25-2007 9:41 PM In reply to

    • duke46
    • Not Ranked
    • Joined on 04-16-2007
    • Posts 8
    • Bronze Member

    Re: Best Cartridge??

    Hi Guys,

    I might need to post this some where else but I think I need a bit of help or advice? My main 3400 table has worked well but it been months using it because I was setting up every thing in my other recording location. I tried it today and played fine but when it went to lift up and retract it slid across the lp? Not Good!!! If I hit the pause it would lift up like it should and then back down ok. It I hit stop the it would lift a bit but drag the lp? I have a spare parts 3400 that I got screwed on off eBay by a jerk and it does lift up and will clear an LP I think so maybe I have a part but not sure what to look for so this should be fun? But If any one has an idea let me know.

    Thanks

    Duke

  • 04-26-2007 1:47 AM In reply to

    Re: Best Cartridge??

    Needs a bit of a clean! The arm lift and lower is attached to a small cylinder containing silicon and this has started to gum up. It needs cleaning and refilling. Martin has a picture! It was on the old forum.
  • 04-26-2007 10:38 AM In reply to

    • duke46
    • Not Ranked
    • Joined on 04-16-2007
    • Posts 8
    • Bronze Member

    Re: Best Cartridge??

    Thanks,

    I will take a look at my parts one and see if I can fig it out. If any one has the info on the Martin picture that would help. And what silicon would I use should be fun to fig out also. But its a start.

  • 04-30-2007 3:50 PM In reply to

    • benkap
    • Top 500 Contributor
    • Joined on 04-16-2007
    • Oslo, Norway
    • Posts 162
    • Bronze Member

    Re: Best Cartridge??

    Peter:
    I am surprised that the EN copes with the tracking or the rear channels in CD4 records. The CL certainly can though, as Kevin says, the suspensions will harden and this ability reduces.

    This was frequently mentioned in the old forum as well but is there really any concrete proof regarding hardened suspension? I have purchased a number of cartridges second hand during the years and never had any problems.
    Most of these cartridges were passed on and none of my buyers have complained, either, so I would assume that they, too, have had no problems.

    Might Soundsmith donate to me an SMMC20CL for comparison I would happily compare it to my MMC20CL in a very fine condition Stick out tongue 

  • 04-30-2007 4:08 PM In reply to

    Re: Best Cartridge??

    Have personal experience. My CLs don't track as well as they used to and my earlier quad cartridges despite having decent styluses won't track CD4 records which need a cartridge that can track at 45kHz.

    I have offered to test a CL for Soundsmith in the past but it must have got lost in the post!! Laughing I am planning to buy a 20CL+ if I can get it in silver!

  • 05-01-2007 2:32 AM In reply to

    • Dillen
    • Top 10 Contributor
    • Joined on 02-14-2007
    • Copenhagen / Denmark
    • Posts 5,008
    • Founder

    Re: Best Cartridge??

    This photo shows the underside of the Beogram, just below the arm.
    The mechanism will probably have seized, causing the lift function to act too slow (eventually failing completely) and the needle to
    abrade on the record on its way back to park position after playing.

    Of course, the best solution would be to take it all apart, clean
    everything, re-lubricate and put it back together but the deck
    would need a complete ground-up adjusting afterwards.
    The easier way is to place a drop of sewing machine oil on the
    edge of the brass pin where it goes into the guiding brass tube (red arrow on the pic).
    Leave it like this to soak in overnight, if you are impatient you can try moving
    it carefully using pliers, do be gentle and repeat the oil treatment
    until it frees up. 2 or 3 drops of oil is normally needed.
    If you decide to remove the actuating arm (long metal bracket with a tiny notch running in a cam wheel groove, ending
    in a nylon fork),
    take good notes on any springs and especially it's exact position
    in the groove of the cam wheel or you will get in trouble later.
    If you are no good with mechanics better leave it in, the nylon won't
    be hurt by the sewing machine oil (it's acid-free).
    When the brass pin moves freely inside the guiding tube your deck is ready to run.
    Expect a free movement of apprx 2mm.

    The above will apply to several models of the Beogram range, like 1700,2200,2202,2400
    and also some Beocenters 5000,7000,7002 etc.

    Martin


  • 05-01-2007 3:02 AM In reply to

    Re: Best Cartridge??

    Thanks for that Martin. We will turn this into a FAQ!
  • 05-01-2007 9:11 AM In reply to

    • duke46
    • Not Ranked
    • Joined on 04-16-2007
    • Posts 8
    • Bronze Member

    Re: Best Cartridge??

    Thanks Martin,

    Now maybe I can get it back to working like it should and not be worried.

    Duke

  • 05-15-2007 4:34 AM In reply to

    • simonbring
    • Not Ranked
    • Joined on 04-23-2007
    • Stockholm, Sweden
    • Posts 29
    • Silver Member

    Re: Best Cartridge??

    Back to your question about the cartridges; As far as I know it is only the MMC6000 that features the 4-track reproduction?

    I have a Beosystem 6000 at home with a couple of MMC6000:s but I have never tried a MMC20CL, it would be interesting to find out though!

    /simon

  • 05-15-2007 4:56 AM In reply to

    Re: Best Cartridge??

    The 6000 is really the same as all the other cartridges. They are all essentially stereo cartridges but the CD4 able ones can track at up to 45kHz. The CD4 system works by having a couple of normal stereo tracks and also two rear tracks but these are encoded and the frequencies transposed to between 20kHz and 40kHz. The cartridge just sends a stereo signal and those high frequencies are converted back to normal frequencies and sent to the rear channels.
  • 05-27-2007 9:01 AM In reply to

    • duke46
    • Not Ranked
    • Joined on 04-16-2007
    • Posts 8
    • Bronze Member

    Re: Best Cartridge??

    Hi Guys,

    Cartage update.

    I was lucky enough to win the bid on a MMC 20CL that the person said " this cartridge was recently found stored in a jewelry box "  They had sold the table some time back and didn't know where it was. It was in pres-teen condition with the cover on it. My God what a sound it put out and also found out I need to deep clean my LP's with this one and I thought they looked clean!!! My CD-4 part of my stereo never sounded so clear and good.

  • 07-04-2007 5:26 PM In reply to

    Re: Best Cartridge??

    Well I still have my MMC20CL only used a few times as my parents prefered the MMC20EN or MMC20S they have acess to. Those 2 are old and used. That 20CL was NOS and not a mark or anything wrong. Played really good but on some records (used) it hat a tendency to jump a bit. It was used on the Beocenter 2000 so not the best recordplayer.

    I got no use for that 20CL and it comes with the original box and paperwork. The BG8002 I'm now using have a Soundsmith MMC2 and the wish to get an BG8000 is not there.

     If anyone needs it send me a pm with an offer.

Page 1 of 1 (18 items)
Need a cable? Just ask Steve at Sounds Heavenly Need a cable? Just ask Steve at Sounds Heavenly Need a cable? Just ask Steve at Sounds Heavenly
Beoworld Security Certificate

SSL