"elephant"

I think you should get your cash back from the mistake of a purchase and invest in a demo/second life BeoVision 9.

if you don't mind me asking, which stores did you perform the tests at?  I viewed the BV7-40 AND the BV8-40 on Friday at the CBD store (Collins St) and they were both very impressive.

The 7-40 had a blu ray playing and the image looked sharp and good (not overly sharp).

Granted I did not do the extensive study you have performed, but I didn't think they did injustice for what they are.

The_Beonic_Man:

soundproof... some really good points raised in that post and I have often considered getting someone in to calibrate my BV7-40 (Mark III)

Guys, let's not get carried away here. Soundproof isn't talking about 'calibration' or fiddling with your settings on your TV. What he means is checking whether your Sky box or external Freeview box (or DVD player!) is configured to output as RGB. Most are defaulted NOT to output as RGB as, if your TV didn't support it, you may end up seeing nothing.

However, most people should have configured their PS3, DVD player and other devices to output as RGB.

blue2th:

The 7-40 had a blu ray playing and the image looked sharp and good (not overly sharp).

Oh dear. This is the point I made in the other discussion. Just about ANY TV looks good when displaying a Blu-ray or something such as BBC HD. I compared the BV8-40 and BV7-40 MKIV with BBC HD this morning, at my dealers and the picture was outstanding.

However, the picture won't be quite as 'outstanding' when you want SD, upscaled SD DVD or similar. They were the tests Elephant was performing at his store.

Dave:

I think you should get your cash back from the mistake of a purchase and invest in a demo/second life BeoVision 9.

I asked about this, but as the BV9 is way over £14K here, the most we'd get back from our BV7-40 MKIII would be £6K and we'd still have to find an additional £8K. I'd rather buy another watch :) I'm not that keen on watching TV and, to be fair, the BV7-40 generates a darned superb picture when watching Blu-rays or HD, so we'd be 'upgrading' to the BV9 just to watch SD.

The BV9 and bv4 are isf calibrated as they leave the factory- the panasonic screen allows for a whole host of changes to be made which makes the screen of of choice for the professionals who set up home cinemas.

In respect of lcd I dont know- except to say no one home cinema operator I am aware of uses LCD in high end set ups

moxxey:

Dave:

I think you should get your cash back from the mistake of a purchase and invest in a demo/second life BeoVision 9.

I asked about this, but as the BV9 is way over £14K here, the most we'd get back from our BV7-40 MKIII would be £6K and we'd still have to find an additional £8K. I'd rather buy another watch :) I'm not that keen on watching TV and, to be fair, the BV7-40 generates a darned superb picture when watching Blu-rays or HD, so we'd be 'upgrading' to the BV9 just to watch SD.

Good point... but...

If you're going to spend over 10K GBP on a TV (the BV7-40 here), then what is spending 18k GBP on a TV (the BV9 here) which is considerably better looking, bigger, a magnificent performer and without glitches?

to 355 f what is the sony solution to plat sd discs i thought the denon pioneer bluray players are superior

the pioneer lcd does not seemed flawed it shows  amazing freeview sd  even on the dvbt module inside the tv why cant a bv7 

i thought it was well known that the pioneer plasma  panel is superior to panasonic and all av high end installers are having to make do with next best panel it was always done to cost people wouldnt pay 4 k for a 60 inch panel

Dave:

If you're going to spend over 10K GBP on a TV (the BV7-40 here), then what is spending 18k GBP on a TV (the BV9 here) which is considerably better looking, bigger, a magnificent performer and without glitches?

As Elephant and I are only upgrading. ie. we are paying around £3K for the MKIII->MKIV upgrade. We're not paying £10K. I wouldn't pay £10K for a BV7-40 now, in 2009. I didn't pay the original £8.5K in 2007 either. Why not? I upgraded from the BV7-32 MKI and my dealer gave me a superb trade-in (I think I only paid £4000 on top of the trade-in).

Dave, to be fair, it's a bit like buying watches. If I bought a Panerai watch for £10K, why not just push the boat out and get one for £18K? Problem is that that's beyond my boat and I wouldn't feel comfortable spending that kind of cash.

Hi there

On the subject of Pioneer plasma- yes excellent performers as an all in one solution with full isf calibration software available. This is the best solution if you want everything in one box.

What seems to tip the balance though is a high end processor - like a lumagen paired up to the panasonic panel and this seems to be as good as it gets.

With regards to blue ray, you are correct that hardly any BR players manage SD very well, only the Denon and the latest Pioneer do so.

My reference to a Sony solution was linked to its ability to upgrade of the net and to play HDaudio - rather than pure SD performance

The Pioneer LCD is good- still short of a Pioneer plasma though . The screen is nothing special but the porcessing is very good in that set.

A BV7 cant do it- why? because Its not using leading edge technology, the screen is mid to low ranking in quality.

The problem is still the underlying problems one gets with LCD- with  a backlight who only get shades of grey and not black- so you darken the image so you cant see it ( aka the BV7) 

355f:

A BV7 cant do it- why? because Its not using leading edge technology, the screen is mid to low ranking in quality.

355f, stop trying to wind us BV7 owners up over our BV7 purchase. Stop it. We've heard it once. It's just your opinion. I too work in the same industry you do, so I can make a valid claim that the BV7-40 MKIII does perform. SD is more than adequate and Blu-ray/HD performance stacks up close to the BV9/BV4. Yes, they are smoother, but not hugely better.

Ok, there are sw problems, sure, but the BV7-40 MKIII does perform. The MKIV is even better for Blu-ray/HD, but sadly less of a performer when it comes to SD.

thanks for the info i nearly bought a bv7 32 but can see why not to even after a demo on dvd  sd it was not good enough pity because it looked good do you know what dvd was in the bv7 32 dvd is it pioneer dv 360

what are your thoughts on projectors are they the way to go 

with HQV Reon-VX video processing is this good 

why dont bno use the best electronics surely this makes up the bulk of the cost of any product if using samsung gear does that reduce there reputation or does a lot af tweaking refinements make a big difference

moxxey:

The_Beonic_Man:

soundproof... some really good points raised in that post and I have often considered getting someone in to calibrate my BV7-40 (Mark III)

Guys, let's not get carried away here. Soundproof isn't talking about 'calibration' or fiddling with your settings on your TV. What he means is checking whether your Sky box or external Freeview box (or DVD player!) is configured to output as RGB. Most are defaulted NOT to output as RGB as, if your TV didn't support it, you may end up seeing nothing.

However, most people should have configured their PS3, DVD player and other devices to output as RGB.

Moxxey is right here, though the improvement I saw was in the SD signal. Quite excellent. I had already run an HMDI test from my laptop to the TV, to ascertain that it had a good HD-ready image, which it did.
But ensuring that I was feeding it an RGB signal did the trick when it came to SD - and I strongly recommend checking that yours is similarly configured.

Mox, Im not trying to wind anyone up!

The complaints relate mainly to the technology itself- one cant expect what some individuals seem to want if its beyond the capability of the technology!

355f:

The complaints relate mainly to the technology itself- one cant expect what some individuals seem to want if its beyond the capability of the technology!

What complaints? Anyone here complained about HD or Blu-ray with the BV7-40? No. It's superb. MKIV improves this further. So, in terms of picture quality, the BV7 *can* muster up a superb image, depending on source. It's often the source that counts.

However, where the BV7 fails, isn't HD/Blu-ray PQ, it's the sw, support, implementation and so on.

soundproof:

Moxxey is right here, though the improvement I saw was in the SD signal. Quite excellent. I had already run an HMDI test from my laptop to the TV

Problem is that, with the BV7-40 at least, the SD part is built-in to the TV through DVB-T or the newer DVB-HD. Perhaps B&O haven't configured their own module to output an RGB signal? :)

Do you think it's worth going from the MkIII to the MKIV ?

i wish bno had never got involved with samsung in the first place.. ever since they have they've gone completely down the drain , really sad

samsung just aren't a prestige manufacturer , sorry. ( in fact they're a bit like sanyo or sansui - ie; naff )

why didn't they approach pioneer - who use the ICE products in their amps ?

now pioneer , now you're talkin' ! :)

best japanese av company of all time imo

imagine what bno could've done with the kuro !!!!

Flappo The Grate:

samsung just aren't a prestige manufacturer , sorry. ( in fact they're a bit like sanyo or sansui - ie; naff )

Don't forget that Apple own something like 15% of Samsung's LCD panel manufacturing plant and their panels were very good, until they moved away from Samsung and used 'lesser' panels for their MacBook etc.

I don't think there's a huge amount wrong with the Samsung panels. This is proved by watching a good HD signal on the BV7-40. It's almost flawless. If the Samsung panel was so 'bad', why is it capable of showing such a good image?

No, the problem is B&O's and the way they handle SD. The MKIII is clearly better than the MKIV for handling SD and yet it shares the same chassis/BS3.

I don't think there's very much B&O can do with LCD panels - whoever they are from - until OLED. 355f is right about that one. However, they are still a couple years off, both in mass-manufacturing 40"+ versions of OLED and making sure they survive, long-term.

On a sidenote, isn't the Kuro a plasma panel? Why is the Kuro better than the BV4 or BV9? It's not, in my opinion.

ok , maybe the scaling of the beosystem 3 isn't up to scratch ?

it's already been stated that it's a bit outdated and is incapable of handling dts hd

Flappo The Grate:

ok , maybe the scaling of the beosystem 3 isn't up to scratch ?

it's already been stated that it's a bit outdated and is incapable of handling dts hd

That's what I suggested in another thread. It might have been state-of-the-art in 2006 (and designed in 2005), but that's four years ago since that chipset would have been designed. There's only so much you can do with software.

Mind you, doesn't explain how the BV8-40 can pretty much match the BV7-40 now. That doesn't even have a BS3. Indeed, I wonder what powers the picture processing on the BV8 chassis (which will then power the BV10, BV7-32 MKV etc).

355f:

The BV9 and bv4 are isf calibrated as they leave the factory- the panasonic screen allows for a whole host of changes to be made which makes the screen of of choice for the professionals who set up home cinemas.

In respect of lcd I dont know- except to say no one home cinema operator I am aware of uses LCD in high end set ups

Surely a factory ISF calibration would only be valid for the ancilliary equipment with which the TV was connected.

Does the Beosystem 3 processor have a full set of adjustments on a per input basis?

Terry, surely the digital content sent via HDMI is interpreted by the BS3 and outputted as required? ie. the BS3 doesn't know the difference between the content send from a PS3, Sky box or Apple TV, via HDMI. You can't 'calibrate' based around the external box.

What you can do is tweak the internal processor to smooth the incoming digital content or sharpen etc. So, if SD is pixelated, and the BS3 doesn't bother smoothing on the BV7, it will resulted in a very obviously pixelated picture.

Thats the idea of ISF you can calibrate the individual connected source

they calibate it for inbuild SD and assume one connects a bs2 as a DVDsource and that explains why the image is so good for SD

I cant vouch for the BS3 range of IS adjustments but I can confirm the panasonic panel is full of options in this regard( this is the BV4/9

355f:

Thats the idea of ISF you can calibrate the individual connected source

they calibate it for inbuild SD and assume one connects a bs2 as a DVDsource and that explains why the image is so good for SD

But that would explain why HD images on the BV7-40 MKIV are so good and a step-up from the MKIII. The BS3 is possibly calibrated to get the most from HD sources, which would include HD via the DVB-HD module, which is built-in? This would explain why SD is more poor and pixelated on the MKIV as they've calibrated it around getting the most from HD.