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This is the first Archived Forum which was active between 17th April 2007 and 1st March February 2012

 

Latest post 07-26-2008 11:14 AM by Ehlerz. 49 replies.
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  • 05-05-2007 4:50 AM

    BL5 or BL9 ? That's the question.

    I'm facing a problem; i just can't decide whether i buy a pair of BL5 or BL9

    1.º - BL5 are full digital and BL9 aren't

    2.º - The capacity of room adaptation is a must

    The main purpose is to have a 5.1 system, and then who knows a 7.1.

    Should i buy 2 pairs of BL5 or 1 pair of BL5 and 1 of BL9, perhaps 2 pairs of BL9 ?

     
    Then i read an article saying that you must have your BL5 1,5 m away from your wall to have the most of the sound.

    I a little bit lost.

    Help wanted please.



     

    Pedro "Less is more"

    BV7-40 MKII + BL7.2 + BL9 + BL3 + BS4 + BL4 + A9 + Earset 2 + 2 x Beo4 + BeoCom 5

    Filed under: ,
  • 05-05-2007 4:54 AM In reply to

    • Dave
    • Top 50 Contributor
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    Re: BL5 or BL9 ? That's the question.

    BUY BEOLAB 5

    “Quality is never an accident; it is always the result of intelligent effort.”

    Your health and well-being comes first and fore-most.

     

     

  • 05-05-2007 5:04 AM In reply to

    Re: BL5 or BL9 ? That's the question.

    pedrompinto:

     Then i read an article saying that you must have your BL5 1,5 m away from your wall to have the most of the sound.

    That would be my doing - the distance from walls (though I must add that the opinion is that of David Moulton). This depends upon how loud you will be playing, and how large a room you will be filling with your BL5s. For regular listening, about a meter will do. I don't think you'll find any audiophile in the world who has placed free standing speakers right up against a wall - speakers come alive when you let them breathe. And the distance is decided by the power of the speakers. The BL5s can be very powerful, if you max them out (I would pity your ears if you're too close) and then you would need the larger distance from the wall.

    Listen to them. Let your ears help you decide - get the dealer to install your candidate setups in your home. That's what B&O is for!
     

  • 05-05-2007 5:40 AM In reply to

    Re: BL5 or BL9 ? That's the question.

    At home we have a pair of lab 5s front, and a pair of lab 8000s rear and the whole setup sounds fantastic for movies with 5.1 and also fantastic for music with just the two lab 5s playing. We have the best for both films and music. I would highly recommend that you consider buying a pair of beolab 5s as front speakers. They really add a lot of power to movies sequences and make the film come alive. As for the other speakers in your setup, it depends on what you are going to be using it for. If it is for music that has been recorded in 5.1 surround sound, then as Dave moulton says ideally you would want 5 lab 5s or 5 lab9s ie each speaker as powerful as the others. If for films however, and I assume that you want to mainly watch films then I would go with 2 lab 9s for the rears. Having 2 lab 5s as rear speaker is really a waste of money if you are mainly watchin films as the amount of sound sent to rear speakers in a 5.1 setup isn't very much - this is why our setup sounds good even though we only have 2 lab 8000s for rears. If however you want to listen to music with 4 speakers at the same time - enhanced stereo then you need all your speakers to be the same so 4 lab 5s or 4 lab 9s would be best. For just a 5.1 setup for films that produces good stereo music aswell, I would recommend 2 lab5s front, and 2 lab9s rear. Then if you really want to change to a 7.1 setup then you can choose from either lab 9s, lab 3 or lab 8000s, 4000s. Some may argue that lab 9s for rears is a waste of money in which case you could look at lab 3s or 8000s, however as you seem prepared to spend such a large amount of  money in the first place, I suggest the 2lab5s, 2lab9s as best for both 5.1 films, and 2.1 channel stereo. So it depends what is more important - films or music and also practical issues such as cost and how big your room size is.
  • 05-05-2007 5:53 AM In reply to

    Re: BL5 or BL9 ? That's the question.

    For a sound + movie solution i do agree that i should use 4 BL 5 or 9; i'more an audio lad, but of course i do like to see some movies of course.

    My main doubt is to have the most of BL5, but i have to obey to the specs. of them; the distance from the walls etc. etc.

    I heard a pair of BL5 and a pair of BL6000 @ my local store and they sounded quite good (your solution at home), but perhaps i have to hear the solutions @ my home.

    I'll check the room dimentions and i'll post a new thread.

     

    Pedro "Less is more"

    BV7-40 MKII + BL7.2 + BL9 + BL3 + BS4 + BL4 + A9 + Earset 2 + 2 x Beo4 + BeoCom 5

  • 05-05-2007 6:03 AM In reply to

    Re: BL5 or BL9 ? That's the question.

    Good idea! But as others have said I think your best solution is to have your own home demo. Your B&O dealer can't really complain if you're about to buy BL5s or even a pair of BL9s I think.
  • 05-05-2007 6:21 AM In reply to

    Re: BL5 or BL9 ? That's the question.

    I thought I'd summarise my last post Big Smile

    For 2.1 stereo sound + 5.1 movies the best combination is 2 lab 5s and 2 lab 9s - best of both film and music without breaking the bank.

    For music in enhanced stereo (4 speakers at same time) best is 4 speakers all the same - lab 5 rears instead of lab9 rears won't improve movies very much though - not worth the extra £5000 if used only for movies. Worth it if used mainly for music in enhanced stereo.

    For 5.1 channel music and films, best is 5 lab 5s - but this is too expensive and overkill for almost everyone especially if you don't listen to 5.1 channel music it is a complete waste of money. Only worth it if you listen to / mix music in 5.1 channels ie people like Dave Moulton.

    But yes, if you can find a store that has 4 beolabs 5s for you to borrow then try them out at home anyway hehe I would just to hear what 4 lab 5s sound like lol !!  hmm not sure what I'm doing in over my holidays yet, this could be an interesting project hehe. Cool

  • 05-05-2007 6:47 AM In reply to

    Re: BL5 or BL9 ? That's the question.

    Well, four BL5s sound quite disorienting on most kinds of music, to be honest. I've heard it several times. And it's a really overkill way of achieving SPEAKER 4 or 5 sound in a room.

    I've also heard the BV9 with two BL5 fronts and two BL6000 rears, demonstrated by the person who headed the work on the BV9, who said the 6000s did the job as rear speakers excellently.

    I wasn't going to involve myself in this thread, as this topic has been covered often here at BeoWorld, but there is little need for matching speakers all around unless you are listening to the 0,001% of the world's music that is created for matching speakers all around. Movies don't require it either. Good SACD recordings use the back channels to provide the hall/music stage ambience and true rear reflections, not to deliver critical musical information, and therefore do not require matching all around speakers. The new HD Audio formats may make enhanced use of the opportunities for storing higher resolution information for the other sound channels - but that involves extra work during production, and movie theaters aren't geared to process this -- which means you would be creating such mixes for advanced home theatres.

    If you like to upmix two-channel to four or five channel, then as a personal preference you can go with identical speakers all around. But if you want precision sound placement in your media room, that's probably not a good solution. Everything will sound harder to place and larger than natural.

    However - there is work going on at several brands with connecting the subwoofer info to the mid range "traveling sound" perspective. Usually, the subwoofer/woofer sound impulses can't/shouldn't be placed in space -- the bursts should just be there in the room. Anyone with BL5s will testify to the advantage of being able to deliver bass supporting a source either to the left or the right in a soundstage.
    It's possible to move the bass if you have identical bass units in the four corners of the room. You then follow a traveling sound in the mid-range, and tie the bass perspective to this traveling sound, fading woofers up and down with Digital Signal Processing. You then get a bass experience that appears to accompany the other sound, lending weight to it.

    Should that becomes a standard feature, you might want to look into at least placing subwoofers in the back corners. You will also need to have your own house as any apartment neighbours would be turning up to spit roast you!
     

  • 05-05-2007 6:57 AM In reply to

    Re: BL5 or BL9 ? That's the question.

    forget us with our opinions. just get beolab 5's and play with them. you will be happy.
  • 05-05-2007 7:40 AM In reply to

    Re: BL5 or BL9 ? That's the question.

    jooka:
    forget us with our opinions. just get beolab 5's and play with them. you will be happy.

    Very happy! Get a roomfull! Wink 

  • 05-05-2007 7:43 AM In reply to

    Re: BL5 or BL9 ? That's the question.

    soundproof:

    jooka:
    forget us with our opinions. just get beolab 5's and play with them. you will be happy.

    Very happy! Get a roomfull! Wink 

     LOL soundproof, this does not at all contradict any of your earlier advice - not disorientating at all!!
     

  • 05-05-2007 7:57 AM In reply to

    • Tom
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    Re: BL5 or BL9 ? That's the question.

    if I could afford BL5s, I would buy them, not matter what others would say.

    Music washes away from the soul the dust of everyday life. - Berthold Auerbach

  • 05-05-2007 7:59 AM In reply to

    Re: BL5 or BL9 ? That's the question.

    tom:

    if I could afford BL5s, I would buy them, not matter what others would say.

     Lol are you married, because it sounds like you don't have a wife. You could buy them but you may be evicted from your own house lol.
     

  • 05-05-2007 9:58 AM In reply to

    Re: BL5 or BL9 ? That's the question.

    beodude:
    soundproof:

    jooka:
    forget us with our opinions. just get beolab 5's and play with them. you will be happy.

    Very happy! Get a roomfull! Wink 

     LOL soundproof, this does not at all contradict any of your earlier advice - not disorientating at all!!
     

    He-he.

    I'm just having so much fun with the variety of advice to most questions here. I could write a book about the reasons why you wouldn't want to have the same speakers all around you when listening to quality recordings - it's a little different with movies, but not as much as people believe, since there's no signal being produced that takes advantage of everything a BL5 behind you can do.

    Best analogy, maybe ... Imagine a large powerboat, it's got the engine and propellers providing forward thrust in the back. In the front you may have one or two bow thrusters, much smaller, but very efficient at letting you guide the boat in and out of berths. Same with a media room - the brain isn't very good at handling a deluge of information, and there's quite a lot going on in front of you. Let the big engine and propellers be there, and then have some nimble bow thrusters in the back, to add the missing bits. You don't need a 360-degree engine to get the most out of your ride!

  • 05-05-2007 10:00 AM In reply to

    Re: BL5 or BL9 ? That's the question.

    beodude:
    tom:

    if I could afford BL5s, I would buy them, not matter what others would say.

     Lol are you married, because it sounds like you don't have a wife. You could buy them but you may be evicted from your own house lol.
     

    Girlfriends are devious. They'll make a mental note that the AV hardware is deeply questionable, but they won't raise the issue until you're hooked. By the time the ring's on your finger, your hobby is in the garage - if you're lucky.
     

  • 05-05-2007 11:40 AM In reply to

    Re: BL5 or BL9 ? That's the question.

    Personally, I would (and have done so!) go for the BL5s.  The room adaptation by itself is almost worth the price difference, as you have surmised.  

    Distance from walls is a problem for ALL loudspeakers.  BL5s probably suffer LESS than most.  Nonetheless, 1.5 m isn't a bad recommendation for distance from walls.  However, if you can't do it, it's not the end of the world.  

    I respectfully disagree with those who say that BL5 surround speakers are overkill.  Identical speakers for all channels is the best, if you can afford it.  We use different rear speakers for a variety of practical (and often quite important) reasons, but such choices are almost always a compromise.  

    I hope this helps.  Good luck with your choice!

    Best,

    Dave Moulton
    Dave
  • 05-05-2007 12:24 PM In reply to

    • Kevin
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    Re: BL5 or BL9 ? That's the question.

    Ok the last time I'll say when we were in Struer (promise Laughing)

    In the listening room they had the BL9's set quite close to the back wall which was mentioned by several members. The reply was that this is where they thought we would put the speakers so they were placed there for every test during development. Lee and others said that this actually meant they sounded less good than the setups they had at home. 

  • 05-05-2007 12:44 PM In reply to

    • 9 LEE
    • Top 10 Contributor
    • Joined on 02-14-2007
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    Re: BL5 or BL9 ? That's the question.

    Agreed, the Beolab 9's behind the test curtain sounded more like BL4's with a BL2 set low than a pair of BL9's!!  My 9's at home sound miles better, and the crispness of the acoustic lens wasn't apparent at all in 2 of the 3 tracks played to us.

    Lee

    BeoWorld - Everything Bang & Olufsen

  • 05-05-2007 2:29 PM In reply to

    Re: BL5 or BL9 ? That's the question.

    9 LEE:
    Agreed, the Beolab 9's behind the test curtain sounded more like BL4's with a BL2 set low than a pair of BL9's!!  My 9's at home sound miles better, and the crispness of the acoustic lens wasn't apparent at all in 2 of the 3 tracks played to us.

    Lee

     Were you seated at the focal point of the Lab9s, Lee?

    As to Dave's recommendation above. I was out in the garden trying to think of reasons why I'd want to have four BL5s, and came up with one!

    With BeoSystem 3 you can select different sound setups, and rotate the speaker configuration from one to the other. Your front speakers become your back speakers, or side, or whatever. So - with regular listening/watching right ahead, you can punch in CINEMA and rotate the soundstage to fit with the screen, on another wall (hmmm - maybe have the couch rotate, as well!). Presto - you'd want the same speakers all around then.

    Cheers - and whatever you do, get the very best speakers you can afford and sensibly fit in. It matters a lot to your experience. The BL5s Dave helped develop are right up there in the stratosphere. Their music have put tears in my eyes, goose pimples on my skin and made the hair on the the back of my neck stand up in brilliantly resolved musical passages!
     

  • 05-05-2007 3:10 PM In reply to

    • Alex
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    • Joined on 04-16-2007
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    Re: BL5 or BL9 ? That's the question.

    Agreed, there is no compromise in terms of the BeoLab 5s!!

    For rears though, BeoLab 3s are the most suitable IMO. Do you have a BeoSystem 3/BeoVision 9? If so, it might be worth getting four BeoLab 3s for rears (instead of two BeoLab 9s).

     Weekly top artists:                   

  • 05-05-2007 3:12 PM In reply to

    • Tom
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    Re: BL5 or BL9 ? That's the question.

    soundproof:
    beodude:
    tom:

    if I could afford BL5s, I would buy them, not matter what others would say.

     Lol are you married, because it sounds like you don't have a wife. You could buy them but you may be evicted from your own house lol.
     

    Girlfriends are devious. They'll make a mental note that the AV hardware is deeply questionable, but they won't raise the issue until you're hooked. By the time the ring's on your finger, your hobby is in the garage - if you're lucky.
     

    Laughing I'm not yet married, but somehow on my way to. But concerning AV hardware, I think that SWMBO is on the same trip than I am. Not that she likes the sound or the image, that is secondary to her, the important thing is that it looks good. The only problem there is: she prefers the 9s to the 5s...

    Music washes away from the soul the dust of everyday life. - Berthold Auerbach

  • 05-05-2007 3:27 PM In reply to

    • Alex
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    Re: BL5 or BL9 ? That's the question.

    Tell her you'll take her on a holiday to Hawaii if you can get BL5s! Big Smile

    I'm guessing you can afford it if you can afford 4 x BeoLab 5s!

     Weekly top artists:                   

  • 05-05-2007 4:20 PM In reply to

    Re: BL5 or BL9 ? That's the question.

    There is actually another very good reason to go for the 4 Beolab 5s if you can afford it. If you have a Beosystem 3 (either in a BV9 or driving a different screen) and you also plan to have a projector either now or at a later stage, it may well be that the layout of your room will be best suited to the plasma screen and the projector screen being set at right angles in the room on different walls. With the BS3, one has the ability to set up the room so that depending on the screen, the system sets up the speakers as front , back, left and right in the correct orientation for each screen without you messing about. To do this however, one requires the speakers to be the same.

    Having seen a projector in action today, this is not a small point!  

  • 05-05-2007 4:22 PM In reply to

    • Alex
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    Re: BL5 or BL9 ? That's the question.

    Very good point Peter! What about the centre channel though? Do you have two set up?

     Weekly top artists:                   

  • 05-05-2007 4:41 PM In reply to

    Re: BL5 or BL9 ? That's the question.

    Usually the TV set will have a centre speaker and the  projector screen will need one as well. There are a variety of set ups programmable - see your friendly local dealer! Most dealers will be delighted to see you in store. They will be even more delighted if you buy 4 Beolab 5s but you don't have to! Encourage friends to see what they are missing! Evangelise! To keep B&O producing wonderful equipment to delight us, they need customers. The more they get, the better the products! I tend to give B&O as gifts at weddings etc partly because it is a superb present and partly because it introduces the range to friends who might not think of buying B&O. Never had a complaint yet! Laughing
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