General Forum

Re: Your thoughts please!

saf — Thu, 07 Feb 2008 14:20:25 GMT

Ok, Andy (the gun is safely back at the drawer of my bedside table)

Re: Your thoughts please!

j0hnbarker — Thu, 07 Feb 2008 14:20:08 GMT

Jandyt:
saf:

a group of very B&O-knowledgeable people (where I do not belong)
a group of people chasing the latest thing (where I do not belong)
a group of great collectors (where I do not belong),
a group of sound & vision experts (where I do not belong),
a group of fantastic linguists (where I do not belong)
a group of people you can’t outwit (where I do not belong)
a group of people who always behave (where I do not belong)
a group of people … etc. etc.
May I add..
a group of people who are friendly, love their B&O and are a pleasure to hear from (where you definately DO belong, Saf)

Andy T.

All good - but let's not meander away from the purpose of this thread, and that is to address Ed's concerns and perhaps have the opportunity to suggest possible improvements to the site. I've noticed that whenever we have been directly asked about the site, the thread tends to end up more with the mutual exchange of pleasantries, rather than a good old-fashioned debate about what's good and what's not. Clearly we're all friends, but let's get back to the point, eh?

Re: Your thoughts please!

Jandyt — Thu, 07 Feb 2008 13:48:11 GMT

saf:

a group of very B&O-knowledgeable people (where I do not belong)
a group of people chasing the latest thing (where I do not belong)
a group of great collectors (where I do not belong),
a group of sound & vision experts (where I do not belong),
a group of fantastic linguists (where I do not belong)
a group of people you can’t outwit (where I do not belong)
a group of people who always behave (where I do not belong)
a group of people … etc. etc.

May I add..

a group of people who are friendly, love their B&O and are a pleasure to hear from (where you definately DO belong, Saf)

Andy T.

Re: Your thoughts please!

Peter — Thu, 07 Feb 2008 13:30:29 GMT

h1npw:
I think the last 2 posts are very relevant............as John says, without wanting to promote an us and them site, I think there are 2 distinct types of interest that visit the site and it would be worthwhile considering catering for the 2 groups in a more distinct and even way than at present.
With regards to Eduards views - for the site to be successful it will have to look to continually improve and keep "raising the bar". The moderators should indeed be focused on the KPIs regarding member numbers and general activity levels. At the same time Lee has to strike a very very careful balance of marketing and self (meaning the moderating team) congratulatory posts not to turn members off and for the site not to become too commercial. I think the idea of a seperate KPI page is also worth considering.
With regards to the independancy of the site I can't agree with Ed's view of "that if they give Beoworld moderators team a lot of information, the moderator team can never be independent. They have to say thank you and that's it".
Thay may have to say thank you - doesn't mean that the moderators or the members have to agree!!! I think recent posts have demonstrated that beyond doubt.
You're keeping very quiet Peter - What are your thoughts?
Cheers
Nigel

I beg the indulgence of the members. I am very quiet simply because I am not around nearly as much! I no longer have any access during the day and I missed this morning as my internet access at home went down! Also out this evening so not back till late!

I try to be friendly with B&O but I don't agree with everything they do. I certainly have criticised many of the new products - the DVD2 and BS6 are certainly deserving of criticism. However I try to be constructive. I am not sure why Ed was so concerned about figures - in fact only Lee and I had access to the site figures in full through another part of the site - I must confess to not looking that often except when I needed a tie breaker for the competition.

I think I can speak for all the moderating team in saying that we will continue to try to keep this site as good as we can and to be as unobtrusive in our moderating as it is possible to be.

Re: Your thoughts please!

saf — Thu, 07 Feb 2008 13:09:22 GMT

Thanks, Puncher!

Maybe I went a bit overboard?!

(I came to think if it's not because both of my parents were teachers ... )

Re: Your thoughts please!

Puncher — Thu, 07 Feb 2008 12:54:48 GMT

saf:

Funny you mention this guys (ie the two distinct groups, ala Porsche clubs). I for one have been actually surprised: I’ve always had an impression that the member’s disposable incomes (or any stereotype socio-demographics for that matter) were definitely not being in the forefront on the Forum. If I noticed any differences between members it has been more like, eg:
a group of very B&O-knowledgeable people (where I do not belong)
a group of people chasing the latest thing (where I do not belong)
a group of great collectors (where I do not belong),
a group of sound & vision experts (where I do not belong),
a group of fantastic linguists (where I do not belong)
a group of people you can’t outwit (where I do not belong)
a group of people who always behave (where I do not belong)
a group of people … etc. etc.
Somehow I feel great here though I apparently do not belong … I guess the greatest thing (up to a point) is to be tolerated by others. It gives a lot of inspiration to become more tolerant and listen to others – and I’m still learning. Personally, if this lesson is served as a kind of self-regulating mix of B&O, other subjects and fun – as it seems to me it indeed is - I guess it’s not so bad at all(, Lee.)

If you ever feel like you need to be alienated any further please let me know - I'm here to help anyone I can

Re: Your thoughts please!

9 LEE — Thu, 07 Feb 2008 12:47:07 GMT

No moderator would ever censor a post to avoid upsetting Bang & Olufsen unless it was either offensive, or gave confidential information that could be damaging to the company.

Neither of these happen on BeoWorld, and the worst we have on here are what i would term 'startlingly accurate rumours'

The moderating team on here prefers the 'hands off' approach, and most of the time we work behind the scenes to make sure everything goes smoothly. Ever double-posted and noticed it miraculously disappeared? Yes, that's us lot - beavering away in the background, not bothering anyone. That's the way we prefer it !!

Lee

Re: Your thoughts please!

saf — Thu, 07 Feb 2008 12:46:33 GMT

Funny you mention this guys (ie the two distinct groups, ala Porsche clubs). I for one have been actually surprised: I’ve always had an impression that the member’s disposable incomes (or any stereotype socio-demographics for that matter) were definitely not being in the forefront on the Forum. If I noticed any differences between members it has been more like, eg:

a group of very B&O-knowledgeable people (where I do not belong)

a group of people chasing the latest thing (where I do not belong)

a group of great collectors (where I do not belong),

a group of sound & vision experts (where I do not belong),

a group of fantastic linguists (where I do not belong)

a group of people you can’t outwit (where I do not belong)

a group of people who always behave (where I do not belong)

a group of people … etc. etc.

Somehow I feel great here though I apparently do not belong … I guess the greatest thing (up to a point) is to be tolerated by others. It gives a lot of inspiration to become more tolerant and listen to others – and I’m still learning. Personally, if this lesson is served as a kind of self-regulating mix of B&O, other subjects and fun – as it seems to me it indeed is - I guess it’s not so bad at all(, Lee.)

Re: Your thoughts please!

Puncher — Thu, 07 Feb 2008 12:43:28 GMT

h1npw:

I think the last 2 posts are very relevant............as John says, without wanting to promote an us and them site, I think there are 2 distinct types of interest that visit the site and it would be worthwhile considering catering for the 2 groups in a more distinct and even way than at present.
With regards to Eduards views - for the site to be successful it will have to look to continually improve and keep "raising the bar". The moderators should indeed be focused on the KPIs regarding member numbers and general activity levels. At the same time Lee has to strike a very very careful balance of marketing and self (meaning the moderating team) congratulatory posts not to turn members off and for the site not to become too commercial. I think the idea of a seperate KPI page is also worth considering.
With regards to the independancy of the site I can't agree with Ed's view of "that if they give Beoworld moderators team a lot of information, the moderator team can never be independent. They have to say thank you and that's it".
Thay may have to say thank you - doesn't mean that the moderators or the members have to agree!!! I think recent posts have demonstrated that beyond doubt.
You're keeping very quiet Peter - What are your thoughts?
Cheers
Nigel

In truth I would expect the Moderating team to maintain a neutral stance with regard to the company, neither overly for or against. I happen to believe that is pretty much what we have at the moment, I don't see any particular B&O presense or influence on the site, the forum content is unmoderated (excluding the obvious abuse, liable etc) and B&O get heavily critisised at times - there is no attempt to edit these posts and therefore the forum is the voice of BeoWorld - not Lee or Peter.

Re: Your thoughts please!

Daniel — Thu, 07 Feb 2008 12:33:39 GMT

Erik-nl:

What I personaly hate most on the site - is the answer "GO AND ASK YOUR LOCAL B&O DEALER"

But sometimes that answer is the correct answer. And even if you haven´t bought something from the dealer and maybe never will buy something you´r still free to ask them questions. A dealer would be a complete idiot if he doesn´t see a potential costumer.

Erik-nl:

I therefore strongly suggest that they support us - maybe by donating a monthly gift/price to the site

That wouldn´t benefit BeoWorld as a free site independent from Struer. For an example a moderator could censor a post just to avoid upsetting them.

Re: Your thoughts please!

h1npw — Thu, 07 Feb 2008 11:32:00 GMT

I think the last 2 posts are very relevant............as John says, without wanting to promote an us and them site, I think there are 2 distinct types of interest that visit the site and it would be worthwhile considering catering for the 2 groups in a more distinct and even way than at present.

With regards to Eduards views - for the site to be successful it will have to look to continually improve and keep "raising the bar". The moderators should indeed be focused on the KPIs regarding member numbers and general activity levels. At the same time Lee has to strike a very very careful balance of marketing and self (meaning the moderating team) congratulatory posts not to turn members off and for the site not to become too commercial. I think the idea of a seperate KPI page is also worth considering.

With regards to the independancy of the site I can't agree with Ed's view of "that if they give Beoworld moderators team a lot of information, the moderator team can never be independent. They have to say thank you and that's it".

Thay may have to say thank you - doesn't mean that the moderators or the members have to agree!!! I think recent posts have demonstrated that beyond doubt.

You're keeping very quiet Peter - What are your thoughts?

Cheers

Nigel

Re: Your thoughts please!

j0hnbarker — Thu, 07 Feb 2008 10:52:38 GMT

Erik-nl:

In the Netherlands we have two porsche clubs
One high nosed posh club with mainly new "showing of" cars - with drivers which never opens the engine compartment
Another one "a poor mans version" with general older models full of interisting people loving getting their hands dirty .
Maybe making something similiar is needed for beoworld ?

Good suggestion Erik. It's not to say that someone who owns a Beovision 5 HD won't own a Beomaster 1000 and vice versa, but as someone whose latest B&O product is a 2003 Avant, I tend to be more interested in the older stuff and I sometimes find that discussion relating to these products is spread across the general/vintage/workbench/beogram forums. Conversely, it seems that the majority of posts about current (and let's be honest, too expensive for many of the second-hand fans here) products are confined to the General forum. With the General forum being most prominent, I often find that I have to scroll all the way down to the other forums to search for interesting posts, and this scrolling by its very nature puts off some people from visiting and posting in these forums compared to the general one. Perhaps the introduction of a photo gallery accessible to all will provide more of an outlet for those who want to show off their latest (brand-new) acquisitions - or could we keep the general forum more 'general' by adding a 'current/new products forum or deleting some of the beogram/vintage forums so that posts relating to these subjects appear in the general interest one?

I really don't mean to create a 'them and us' situation here. We all love B&O, otherwise we wouldn't be here, but maybe a little tweaking with the other forums wouldn't go amiss?!

Re: Your thoughts please!

Erik-nl — Thu, 07 Feb 2008 09:57:20 GMT

In the Netherlands we have two porsche clubs

One high nosed posh club with mainly new "showing of" cars - with drivers which never opens the engine compartment

Another one "a poor mans version" with general older models full of interisting people loving getting their hands dirty .

Maybe making something similiar is needed for beoworld ?

What I personaly hate most on the site - is the answer "GO AND ASK YOUR LOCAL B&O DEALER"

I can (and will not) pay the new price B&O equipment which look like space ships and is not even technological up in front - I understand that B&O need to differentiate their market and there new product will never be intended for me. Respect for that. However, we (ordinary people) secondhand users of B&O is definitely helping them maintaining their heritage and good name - by assisting in keeping so much elderly equipment runing.

I therefore strongly suggest that they support us - maybe by donating a monthly gift/price to the site.

A Jacob Jensen fan

Re: Your thoughts please!

Pascinal — Thu, 07 Feb 2008 09:34:05 GMT

I hope he stay's, but something blocking him!!

Re: Your thoughts please!

deaddruid — Thu, 07 Feb 2008 05:05:43 GMT

Eduard,

I am glad you have not left the site, since I've always found your posts helpful (or at least interesting!). Please remember that it is only by keeping people with differing views on the site, that it can remain balanced - in other words, if your comments are accurate, then your presence is necessary.

Regarding prizes - I took a gold membership because Lee was very straight with me about the benefits of gold. My financial justification was that for the cost of two manuals on eBay, I would get access to manuals as I need them, support a forum which I want to see survive, and have a small chance of winning something unexpected. If the prizes were to cease, I would still renew in 2008, because I want to support a forum which has given me the support I needed.

The prize draw adds excitement and interest. It is a focal point for the BeoWorld "family" every month, and I would hate to see the loss of that social event. On the other hand, some draws (such as the March 2008 one) seem to have an excess of high value prizes. Of course, there is nothing to stop us from offering to donate prizes - assuming Lee is willing to accept them!

Mark