General Forum

Re: b&o workingon new tetevision based on windows

Alex — Sun, 16 Dec 2007 14:49:06 GMT

B&O really should look at Linux distributions instead of Windows. Cheaper, more stable, far FAR more flexible and more multi-platform capable...

Re: b&o workingon new tetevision based on windows

Maarten — Sun, 16 Dec 2007 14:46:09 GMT

Does it mean that we'll have to reboot our TV sets every so many hours to clear up registers, yet another security patch has to be installed, it's frozen etc etc :)

Re: b&o workingon new tetevision based on windows

mawheele — Sun, 16 Dec 2007 14:00:56 GMT

Yes it is possible for B&O to develop a system and apply their unique look and feel using systems other than Microsoft Windows. I imagine they have gone down the MSFT route because their engineering has experience for Windows Media, .Net and Visual Studio. They can also buy-in motherboards cheaply from outside vendors that will run the OS and applications. It would essentially be a B&O skinned Windows Media PC. As a result, its likely perceived to be quicker and cheaper for them to develop.

If they truly want to apply a unique B&O experience, they could do better by looking at a combination of Adobe AIR, Flash and Flex that will support a wider range of High Definition Audio and Video content that is coming to the web and have greater interoperability with third-party products. Take a look at how the BBC have done it. http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/page/item/b008hypn.shtml

Re: b&o workingon new tetevision based on windows

beo-ap — Sun, 16 Dec 2007 12:08:44 GMT

BeoNut1:
one of the reasons I feel safe investing in B&O is that I see their equipment as somewhat future-proof. To align themselves with Microsoft Windows will in my humble opinion ultimately undermine some of the "future proof-ness" of B&O's brand.

Agree. When was the last time you successfully booted a PC with Win 5/98/ME? And now Microsoft faces a very big problem with market resistance to Vista. What's B&O to do in a digital world? Certainly not jump on the Windows bandwagon. BTW, I writing this from a Sony Vaio with Win XP Home.[:'(]

Re: b&o workingon new tetevision based on windows

beocool — Sun, 16 Dec 2007 08:23:11 GMT

fridsten:
This is really worrying news. I wouldn't support a B&O-Apple collaboration either. B&O shouldn't be depending on a software manufacturer at all. They should create and/or use a Linux distribution instead and keep their independence that way.

Do you think that it is feasible for a company like B&O to create their own software? Personally I believe that their sources are probably limited for this kind of thing. Using linux might be an option, but I'm not an expert on this issue.

Re: b&o workingon new tetevision based on windows

fridsten — Sun, 16 Dec 2007 05:06:42 GMT

This is really worrying news. I wouldn't support a B&O-Apple collaboration either. B&O shouldn't be depending on a software manufacturer at all. They should create and/or use a Linux distribution instead and keep their independence that way.

Re: b&o workingon new tetevision based on windows

BeoNut1 — Sun, 16 Dec 2007 02:03:23 GMT

Thank you Bill. It's really just a repost of a letter that I spent a few weeks molding together a couple of years ago. I never sent it to Mr. Sorensen as I just felt too stupid doing so.

However, a few months ago, when one of our fellow BeoWorlders was meeting with Mr. Sorensen, I decided to post it here in the forums for the first time in hopes that it would stimulate discussion and / or maybe even be seen by someone at B&O.

I hate sounding snotty in my follow up response earlier today, as I so love B&O stuff. But, one of the reasons I feel safe investing in B&O is that I see their equipment as somewhat future-proof. To align themselves with Microsoft Windows will in my humble opinion ultimately undermine some of the "future proof-ness" of B&O's brand. If the info that prompted this thread is accurate AND if there isn't a very Mac compatible solution offered (neither of which we know for a fact), then it is a very sad thing. As "355f" keeps pointing out, the high-end audio market is changing rapidly (and generally for the worse). Apple has the adeptness to navigate and succeed in this market - they certainly have the best software engineers in the world right now - and, they're fundamentally changing their company to move "where the hockey puck will be". However unrealistic on my part, I want B&O to be part of this revolution.

Mark D

Re: b&o workingon new tetevision based on windows

linder — Sat, 15 Dec 2007 23:36:25 GMT

Great letter Mark.

Since I made my previous posting earlier today, I have been thinking about a B&O purchase I had intended to do tomorrow which was to be a Beo5. I think I will still visit the store but I will ultimately wait to see what happens before making a purchase.

I have a Beomedia 1 and only use it for internet radio. In retrospect if I could do it over again, I would not have purchased the Beomedia 1. I love iTunes on my MacBook Pro and have a lot of music in my iTunes library.

Bill

Re: b&o workingon new tetevision based on windows

BeoNut1 — Sat, 15 Dec 2007 19:11:20 GMT

One other thing: like "Maclife" insinuated, as a loyal Apple user this will make it very hard for me to invest in B&O equipment. In the coming year, I am planning on purchasing a BV7, the replacement to the BV4, an additional BeoSystem 3 and possibly some BL5s. I won't do this if there isn't a solution for integrating these items with my Apple equipment and software (i.e. the BeoSound 5 and future BeoMedia products need to have Mac compatibility, too, or I won't be able to justify the cost of B&O's equipment).

Mark D

Re: b&o workingon new tetevision based on windows

BeoNut1 — Sat, 15 Dec 2007 19:00:56 GMT

I, too, find this a scary thought (i.e. B&O's upcoming digital media offerings / BeoSound 5 being based on the Windows platform). I think this will prove to be very short-sighted on B&O's part. I'm going to paste my (never sent) letter to Mr. Sorensen again as it summarizes the way I felt a couple of years ago and continue to feel today.

Mark D

Mr. Torben Ballegaard Sørensen January 4, 2006

Bang & Olufsen a/s

Peter Bangs VEJ15

DK 7600, Struer

Dear Mr. Sørensen,

I am writing in hopes that you might briefly indulge the thoughts of one of your company’s most adamant supporters.

I am a loyal Bang & Olufsen user and have been for the past several years. I love your company, your company’s history, and, of course, your products. I literally daydream about B&O equipment. I am also a loyal Apple computer user having switched from Windows powered machines about five years ago. Over the past several years, I have sold many of my friends on the virtues of both B&O and Apple products. In my humble opinion, B&O and Apple share many similar corporate ideals and, therefore, B&O and Apple subsequently share similar customers. Both companies design simple, ergonomic, and integrated products that appeal to individuals who appreciate technology working “invisibly” in the background to make for a cleaner user experience. And, both companies value ergonomics and design more so than their respective competitors.

Though B&O and Apple certainly make a few similar products, I likewise see these two companies as more complementary to each other rather than outright competitors. B&O is primarily an audio / video equipment manufacturer, and Apple is primarily a computer software / hardware manufacturer (and soon to be media distributer). In my opinion, B&O makes the best A/V equipment and Apple makes the best A/V software. I foresee Apple’s software becoming increasingly important in the arena of consumer media consumption. I would therefore very much like to see B&O work more closely with Apple; in fact, I see any union of these two companies’ products as a way of solidifying and guaranteeing B&O’s future presence in the rapidly changing marketplace that is consumer media.

For the past couple of years, I have actually contemplated writing you and enclosing a piece of Apple equipment (a wireless Apple Airport Express WiFi hub) as I would love to somehow convince someone within your company of the elegance of Apple’s software and what I see as Apple’s plan to change the way consumers acquire music and video. I keep hesitating to do so as I realize that this would seem incredibly audacious on my part - I am not an engineer or audio / video specialist (I am actually a retinal surgeon). Also, I realize that B&O has it’s own audio / visual software, it’s own “media hub”, and it’s own mp3 player. Yet, I believe in my heart that Apple is about to change things in a very fundamental way, and I want B&O to be a part of this change.

Just to briefly outline what I see happening to the A/V market from the perspective of a well-informed consumer: I see Apple’s iTunes software and Apple’s wireless audio and video hubs as revolutionizing the way music and video are acquired and played. These integrated pieces of software and hardware have changed the way we listen to music in my house - we now send it wirelessly to our B&O stereos from our Apple computers. These integrated solutions are driven by a magnificently clean user interface that incorporates constantly updating software that also allows for music and videos to be purchased. And, Apple’s software allows me to do this for either Apple or Windows based computers. I have also set up this same type of home audio system for many of my friends (using a combination of B&O and Apple equipment), and I have been able to experience first-hand how much people enjoy this particular confluence of technology. Soon, we will be able to do this with video, too, when Apple releases their “iTV” product (name subject to change). I fully expect to wirelessly send movies to my B&O television in the very near future.

I believe that Apple’s market share in terms of computer users will start to significantly rise over the next few years, but (more importantly) I believe that Apple’s software and their wireless hubs will find their way in to consumers’ living rooms (regardless of which type of computer, stereo, or TV the consumer owns). I also believe that Apple will soon introduce some sort of computer based audio-video “server” that will become the proverbial and oft-promised “digital hub” that consumers have anticipated for so long. And, I believe that this digital hub will (like the iPod and iTunes) be designed for Windows and Apple machines, and (like the iPod and iTunes) become the de facto standard.

My humble suggestion is that B&O find a way to partner with Apple and start using Apple’s software (which runs on Windows and Apple machines) to power your hardware. I realize that this would represent a fundamental shift in philosophy for B&O away from “in house” software design. However, if Apple’s CEO, Steve Jobs, were to demo B&O televisions and audio systems utilizing Apple’s forthcoming “media hub” and software, I believe it would be a boon to your company that would actually make it difficult for B&O to keep up with demand. Likewise, and with all due respect, I see Apple’s software design teams as better than those of any other company (including Microsoft and B&O) as Apple is simply so committed to this vision and so good at designing the “end user experience”.

In talking with some B&O employees, I get the impression that B&O does not contemplate the Apple market much (if I am wrong, please excuse my ignorance). Part of this may be based on Apple’s seemingly meager market share, but, as I pointed out, I see this as a moot point as Apple’s audio / video software will be independent of computer type. As an aside, because B&O and Apple attract the same type of consumer, I believe that the percentage of B&O users who also use Apple computers is much higher than the percentage of Apple computer users in the general market place.

Thank you for taking the time to read my overly lengthy letter. For the record, I do realize how truly ridiculous it must sound having someone like me write someone like you and offer advice about future corporate trends. I am very passionate about both B&O and Apple, and I so desperately want these two companies’ products to better integrate. Plus, I obviously feel that some sort of union like the one I am proposing would offer future dividends for B&O as well as secure B&O’s place in an increasingly volatile marketplace. Please also know that it is not my intention to in any way denigrate B&O’s software, wireless efforts, or the Beomedia product. On the contrary, my sole impetus in writing this letter was to offer my admittedly amateurish outlook on a topic that I feel has the potential to strongly effect a company that I love very much - Bang & Olufsen.

Sincerely,

Mark J. Douglas, MD

P.S. I would love to send you an Apple Airport Express or Apple’s upcoming “iTV” product (when it comes out in a few months) if these are things you might like to personally try. I only hesitated in doing so out of fear that a package being sent from a consumer to the president of a company might not actually make it in to your hands. Please do not hesitate to contact me about sending you one of these devices - it would be my honor to do so.

Re: b&o workingon new tetevision based on windows

linder — Sat, 15 Dec 2007 17:30:47 GMT

It is true that it really doesn't matter which operating system B&O uses. However their track record with the Beomedia 1 leaves much to be desired. Software based systems need a large support and development team with a lot of coordination. I am very familiar with managing software development teams based in different countries. I hope B&O is able to do this but my experience tells me this is a lot bigger than they are unless they have partnered with another management firm we are not aware of.

I like digital media and do believe it is the future but when I purchase a product from Bang & Olufsen, I expect very high quality. I would be hard pressed to consider the purchase of Beolab 5's to play 256 KBPS digital music. Maybe one can continue to consider B&O products without the digital components.

Bill

Re: b&o workingon new tetevision based on windows

mawheele — Sat, 15 Dec 2007 11:59:17 GMT

This makes no real difference as to whether you use a Mac or Windows Vista computer or not... So don't worry on that front. This looks like a repeat of the mistake they have made with BeoMedia.

What is at issue is B&O's selection of Codecs and what they end up supporting as a result and the fact that they will likely skin a Microsoft environment which could potentially limit available content (streamed), quality of streamed video (VC1 and WMV) and ability to integrate with other devices - i.e. the ubiquitous iPOD etc.

Hopefully they will extend this agreement to include other codec suppliers to support H.264, Adobe Flash for Full HD streamed content (which the BBC now uses) and HE-AAC, AAC etc. Fundamentally that will be the key to making this a good product or another BeoMedia.

Heres hoping...

Re: b&o workingon new tetevision based on windows

Beowulf — Sat, 15 Dec 2007 08:42:38 GMT

I use both Macs and Pc's I must admit I think that the Mac is much more user friendly, glitch free and intuitive. New Macs can run both operating systems maybe B&o should also be considering this?

Dave

Re: b&o workingon new tetevision based on windows

Chrisreunion — Sat, 15 Dec 2007 07:20:17 GMT

If this was true, it would be both good and bad news for a lot of people.

I think a computer based BeoSound or BeoVision would be a great thing as long as it uses the PC standard for all its advantages:

- Internet connection for complete software downloads and updates of the products, making it possible for B&O to repair many issues by a simple look at the product's software/type;

- CDDB access for all CDs in your collection, NMUSIC and NRADIO integration in audio masters in the future maybe;

- access to Internet sites on your TV without BeoMedia;

- possibility to upgrade the DVD/CD drives whenever a new standard arrives (DVIX software updates, or MP3 lossless);

To me that "Windows based" thing should only focus on Internet connection, USB/wi-fi integration and hard-drive integration. The problem I see is that :

- a lot of people will complain about it being Windows based (what about Mac users?), although I have a PC, many B&O users don't;

- Windows is...Windows, with all its bugs & viruses (imagine your EUR 20,000 BV9 being completely dead because of a virus!!);

- B&O users like simplicity, and most of them don't know much about computers (that may explain why the present computer-based B&O products are so limited), so if something goes wrong, what will they do?

Anyway, this might give you an indication that BeoSound 5 will be...Windows based!

Wait and see...

Re: b&o workingon new tetevision based on windows

maclife — Sat, 15 Dec 2007 07:16:06 GMT

pehre:
see the foollowing article (in german) see http://www.heise.de/newsticker/meldung/100639

… and they are quoting this article:

http://www.wiwo.de/pswiwo/fn/ww2/sfn/buildww/id/133/id/333169/fm/0/SH/0/depot/0

As a 100% Mac user this unfortunately means very bad news for my future investments in B&O products.