General Forum

Re: Beovision 7 verses 9

mr_anders_son — Thu, 18 Oct 2007 13:48:24 GMT

As someone of you know I worke as photographer and use highend camera Hasselblad with 39mpx

So for me right true color is very importent. Same way I look at LCD versus Plasma and if you want true color(realistic)

plasma is far better than LCD. Skintones etc. On the other hand LCD is more sharp and crispy, but little exxagerated color (right word?)

So this is more a subjective feeling if you like LCD or Plasma. BUT plasma deliver the same picture as our eyes ses it, LCD not!

Re: Beovision 7 verses 9

Roger — Thu, 18 Oct 2007 01:09:52 GMT

I've seen them side by side, and the bottom line is that the BeoSystem 3 is great!

The 40" screen has an advantage when it comes to resolution - or it seems to have more detail - compared to the 50". Black is black on both models IMHO, but the BV9 gives me a "BeoLab 5"-feeling: not adding anything, very pure and true to the source. Look at skin tones, the BV9 has the edge. But given the price gap, the BV7 is the obvious winner unless money doesn't matter.

Roger

Re: Beovision 7 verses 9

Beolab — Wed, 17 Oct 2007 16:58:21 GMT

TerryM:

I have always been given to understand that Manufacturers' quoted Contrast Ratios have been found to be grossly optimistic when the relevent TV has been tested in the lab.
Does B & O quote realistic data?
The BV7 Mk111 would have to be a significant improvement over the Mk11,which I found to be disappointing in it's PQ,to sway me away from a BV9.

Yes B&O = Realistic contrast data!

Re: Beovision 7 verses 9

355f — Wed, 17 Oct 2007 16:57:51 GMT

TerryM:

I have always been given to understand that Manufacturers' quoted Contrast Ratios have been found to be grossly optimistic when the relevent TV has been tested in the lab.
Does B & O quote realistic data?
The BV7 Mk111 would have to be a significant improvement over the Mk11,which I found to be disappointing in it's PQ,to sway me away from a BV9.

If you read my previous post on contrast ratios above, you will have the answer to that question.

If you take the latest pioneer screen which has one of the best CR about and then you calibrate it, in fact the contrast ratio drops alarmingly from the stated figures. B&O plasmas are calibrated from the factory.

The only way one can make a judgement on picture quality is to see the latest MK111 and judge for oneself.

It helps to have a little understanding of how the differing technologies develop the picture and then one is aware of the technical and underlying dissadvantges of LCD and Plasma. I think the article goes some way to explain the basic differences.

Re: Beovision 7 verses 9

Beolab — Wed, 17 Oct 2007 16:57:09 GMT

355f:

Its great that your happy with the BV7 and that one considers it such a leap in LCD panel and technology that it renders all known LCD issues defunct. This will be of great comfort to the manufacturers of LCD
Lets leave it at that- its all down to personal preference at the end of the day and human nature dictates that once a purchase has been made one will do anything to defend that purchasing decision- we all do it!

But 355f can you do me a favor to go and see the new BV7 MK III, and then tell us what you think about it!?

Regards

Re: Beovision 7 verses 9

TerryM — Wed, 17 Oct 2007 16:45:43 GMT

I have always been given to understand that Manufacturers' quoted Contrast Ratios have been found to be grossly optimistic when the relevent TV has been tested in the lab.

Does B & O quote realistic data?

The BV7 Mk111 would have to be a significant improvement over the Mk11,which I found to be disappointing in it's PQ,to sway me away from a BV9.

Re: Beovision 7 verses 9

Espen — Wed, 17 Oct 2007 08:06:54 GMT

Hi all,

http://cache.aftenposten.no/multimedia/archive/00615/Pioneerkontrast_615009a.jpg
From this article:
http://forbruker.no/digital/tester/tv/article2002501.ece

The picture shows a comparison between a new pioneer and a panasonic plasma display(TH-42PX70).

I would have liked to se how the BV740 compares to these two.

Re: Beovision 7 verses 9

355f — Wed, 17 Oct 2007 07:38:40 GMT

It depends hows its been meansured have a look here----

Contrast ratio is the difference between the brightest and darkest parts of an image, measured in discrete steps, at any given moment. Generally, the higher the contrast ratio, the more realistic the image is. Contrast ratios for plasma displays are often advertised as high as 20,000:1. On the surface, this is a significant advantage of plasma over other display technologies. Although there are no industry-wide guidelines for reporting contrast ratio, most manufacturers follow either the ANSI standard or perform a full-on-full-off test. The ANSI standard uses a checkered test pattern whereby the darkest blacks and the lightest whites are simultaneously measured, yielding the most accurate "real-world" ratings. In contrast, a full-on-full-off test measures the ratio using a pure black screen and a pure white screen, which gives higher values but does not represent a typical viewing scenario. Manufacturers can further artificially improve the reported contrast ratio by increasing the contrast and brightness settings to achieve the highest test values. However, a contrast ratio generated by this method is misleading, as content would be essentially unwatchable at such settings.

Plasma is often cited as having better black levels (and contrast ratios), although both plasma and LCD have their own technological challenges. Each cell on a plasma display has to be precharged before it is due to be illuminated (otherwise the cell would not respond quickly enough) and this precharging means the cells can achieve a true black. Some manufacturers have worked hard to reduce the precharge and the associated background glow, to the point where black levels on modern plasmas are starting to rival CRT. With LCD technology, black pixels are generated by a light polarization method and are unable to completely block the underlying backlight.

Re: Beovision 7 verses 9

Razlaw — Wed, 17 Oct 2007 07:26:33 GMT

I found a web page, which of course I can not find again now, that indicated the Beovision 9 had a standars contrast of 3000:1 with a maximum contrast of 10,000:1?

Re: Beovision 7 verses 9

355f — Wed, 17 Oct 2007 07:12:19 GMT

Its great that your happy with the BV7 and that one considers it such a leap in LCD panel and technology that it renders all known LCD issues defunct. This will be of great comfort to the manufacturers of LCD

Lets leave it at that- its all down to personal preference at the end of the day and human nature dictates that once a purchase has been made one will do anything to defend that purchasing decision- we all do it!

Re: Beovision 7 verses 9

Beolab — Wed, 17 Oct 2007 06:57:09 GMT

355f:
Beolab:
355f:

All that matters in the end is that you like your BV7 and feel it was a good thing to acquire.
continuing debates about whats'better' does nothing for the amicable rapport that exists here- so I rest my case!
Now contrast ratios! what is it on the bv9 compared to BV7!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
The new Bv7 has 2000:1 in contrast ratio. Look in the specs in the end of the pdf.
http://www.bang-olufsen.com/UserFiles/file/Press/BVi7-40%20EU_PR.pdf
And the new Bv9 1080p Full HD has 3000:1 in contrast ratio, so the gap are not miles between them...
http://www.bang-olufsen.com/UserFiles/File/Products/Technical%20Specifications/BeoVision9_en.pdf
Regards
well its true that the contrast ratio dropped with the 1080 compared to the HD screen, in any event the percentage of increase in CR ratio is huge compared to the LCD and next year the new panasonic panel will have 7000-1 CR ratio.
Plasma in technology terms is just far far ahead- if one cant appreciate these facts or cant notice a difference then buy LCD

Take a look of the new BV7 first...

And the old BV9 HD ready 720p did also have 3000:1 in contrast ratio.

http://www.bang-olufsen.com/UserFiles/File/Products/Technical%20Specifications/BeoVision9_en_na.pdf

Re: Beovision 7 verses 9

Beolab — Wed, 17 Oct 2007 06:56:03 GMT

355f:
Beolab:
355f:

All that matters in the end is that you like your BV7 and feel it was a good thing to acquire.
continuing debates about whats'better' does nothing for the amicable rapport that exists here- so I rest my case!
Now contrast ratios! what is it on the bv9 compared to BV7!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
The new Bv7 has 2000:1 in contrast ratio. Look in the specs in the end of the pdf.
http://www.bang-olufsen.com/UserFiles/file/Press/BVi7-40%20EU_PR.pdf
And the new Bv9 1080p Full HD has 3000:1 in contrast ratio, so the gap are not miles between them...
http://www.bang-olufsen.com/UserFiles/File/Products/Technical%20Specifications/BeoVision9_en.pdf
Regards
well its true that the contrast ratio dropped with the 1080 compared to the HD screen, in any event the percentage of increase in CR ratio is huge compared to the LCD and next year the new panasonic panel will have 7000-1 CR ratio.
Plasma in technology terms is just far far ahead- if one cant appreciate these facts or cant notice a difference then buy LCD

Take a look of the new BV7 first...

And the old BV9 HD ready 720p did also have 3000:1 in contrast ratio.

http://www.bang-olufsen.com/UserFiles/File/Products/Technical%20Specifications/BeoVision9_en_na.pdf

Re: Beovision 7 verses 9

355f — Wed, 17 Oct 2007 06:46:24 GMT

Beolab:
355f:

All that matters in the end is that you like your BV7 and feel it was a good thing to acquire.
continuing debates about whats'better' does nothing for the amicable rapport that exists here- so I rest my case!
Now contrast ratios! what is it on the bv9 compared to BV7!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
The new Bv7 has 2000:1 in contrast ratio. Look in the specs in the end of the pdf.
http://www.bang-olufsen.com/UserFiles/file/Press/BVi7-40%20EU_PR.pdf
And the new Bv9 1080p Full HD has 3000:1 in contrast ratio, so the gap are not miles between them...
http://www.bang-olufsen.com/UserFiles/File/Products/Technical%20Specifications/BeoVision9_en.pdf
Regards

Not miles between them??? its taken 4 geenrations of plasma technology to reach these real world levels if one takes a view that there is little difference between 2000-1 and 3000-1 in contrast ratioit makes you wonder why the manufactuers have worked so hard to strive over the years for these kind of specs!-

Plasma in technology terms is just far far ahead- if one cant appreciate these facts or cant notice a difference then buy LCD

Re: Beovision 7 verses 9

355f — Wed, 17 Oct 2007 06:41:58 GMT

moxxey:
355f:

...early adopters of the BV7 have found already in such a short space of time that the product lags behind even basic products for performance now
I'd disagree with this. As I've mentioned before, my brother has a new 2007 Samsung 32" LCD and, through Freeview, the quality is far inferior to my MKI BV7-32. There are many more artefacts, particularly around fast-moving objects. Sport on my old BV7 is far better than his 2007 Samsung.
This doesn't mean it can't be improved, of course. The brightness and contrast are poor on my old BV7.

Well this is an interesting argument. So your comparing the samsung lcd which costs say £450- which is not reagrded as one of the better LCD by any stretch with the B&O that costs over ten times the price even 2 years ago.

What im saying is, take good quality LCD now thats regarded as being more cutting edge and compare the picture quality to a BV7 Mk1 and im afraid the B&O is MILES behind

Re: Beovision 7 verses 9

moxxey — Wed, 17 Oct 2007 05:40:35 GMT

355f:
...early adopters of the BV7 have found already in such a short space of time that the product lags behind even basic products for performance now

I'd disagree with this. As I've mentioned before, my brother has a new 2007 Samsung 32" LCD and, through Freeview, the quality is far inferior to my MKI BV7-32. There are many more artefacts, particularly around fast-moving objects. Sport on my old BV7 is far better than his 2007 Samsung.

This doesn't mean it can't be improved, of course. The brightness and contrast are poor on my old BV7.