General Forum

Re: Unpacking Beolab 5

folkdeejay — Thu, 17 Nov 2011 04:45:15 GMT

Gosh.

Back in another life, i did on occasion have "ngotiations" with customers based around price/level of service.

It is true to say, and some have indeed done so here, that the historical "norm" is a B&O dealer will include "basic" installation in the ticket price.

This policy really dates from a time when it was tube TV's ( maybe with a STB, maybe not) and/or standalone audio with speakers, often linked if in the same room. All cables managed, all packaging removed, a run-through of major functions to optimise set up and instruct the happy new owner.

Beolink stsyems were always subject to varying charges, depending on the work/cabes required - so was integrating 3rd party products.

The recent convergence of IT, AV and home automation has reduced the number of "standalone" installations. Installing a TV or audio to a high standard, with cables dealt with, basic settings configured and user preferences discussed and implemented is now only the beginning. LAN, Wi-Fi, software flashes, IR coding....all can add hours and hours to an install. Which is fine, and should all be agreed in advance if required.

However, I do read here a lot that isnallation is/should be included in the price. As above, that is , in essence, true. But that also assumes ( from a dealers perspective) that the price is the "ticket price" - probably with a few additional, chargeable, cables etc.

Now - I have no idea ( and am not implying/suggesting anything) about the OP's purchase. don't know, or want to know, how much he paid, who to or where.

BUT, it is often the case that customers will include a "no need to come along, I like setting my own stuff up" during a price negotiation. ie, knock me 5/10/20 % off, and I will plug it in myself.

It was always my policy that once the ticket price is forgotten, all T&C's are based on a new transaction..... I always had a clear offer/understnding that a visit/call out to re-do a customers own set up was still available if needed.....perhaps when we are next passing, but the fact is, if the £30 for fuel and the £XX for a days labour ( or £XXX if you are down south ) has been knocked off the sale price, then it becomes trickier to do this too often without going bust !!!!

I did try to be clear, and often told customers that it was fine to take away what amounted to "plug & play" items such as BS1, DVD1, speaker upgrades etc etc, but the offer to send an installer was still made (if required) although with a nominal charge, to offset the cost of doing so.

Beolab 5's could be simpy connected into some systems by some people but there are a lot of variants, not leaast being the level of tekky awareness of the new owner.

Got to go now, but its an intesting topic..... all a bit away from the op's question....to which, the best answer is ....very carefully. Whoever you are.

Re: Unpacking Beolab 5

KingOfSnake — Thu, 17 Nov 2011 03:09:01 GMT

One last post in an effort to bring this matter to an end.

Perhaps there was some confusion because you wanted to know if there was a special way to open a cardboard box - I could perfectly understand it, as I posted, if you wanted to know how best to handle/move/configure and had never done this before. Although I have lifted Beolab 5 before on myself onto trolleys from installations, at no time would I ever recommend that one person lifts these on there own having no prior experience of using the speakers or handling them.

At no point have I made personal slurs or accusations as you have done, no big deal. Who was bragging? Who was twisting? My concerns were shared by other Members on this forum and if I want to attempt to assist by asking you to check the serial number to check you have new speakers, or to question any other matter, I believe I am at liberty to do so. If you want to take offence and ramble off on other matters then you are equally at liberty to do so.

I posted on the information provided - 18000 Euro speakers, a sync cable, without it appears and support from the supplying Dealer. Once again I am sorry if this has upset you, I will try not to post on any of your threads again.

Re: Unpacking Beolab 5

Maab — Wed, 16 Nov 2011 20:33:20 GMT

soundproof:

Poor Maab. He buys a pair of nice speakers, looks forward to using them, doesn't want to do anything wrong in setting them up, and gets hit by an avalanche of derision by KOS, starting from post nr. 1 from him.

Congratulations with your new speakers, Maab. Hope you're enjoying them.

Yes, I am enjoying them, more than I initially thought. Thank you Soundproof.

I have a milion questions thou, but I will limit my self to just close this dreadful thread ... as I opened it.

I'm surprised to see this thread going on still, but i wish to say this to Kos:

Now, Think about this: there is this guy that bought a set of speakers that are truly unconventional in regard to design-form; lots of electronics in it; he is by himself doing the installation and "he can't wait"; he was going to grab them out of the box by himself. He also wanted to be absolutely certain that no mistakes were made while moving the speakers around... and he was excited about it. Is there something really strange?..........

You kept on bragging about unnecessary theories of yours.... about the serial number (I dont know why...)... about the missing manual (lie- I have two)..., the sync cable's silly statement you've made.... the price I paid (which I never mentioned, why would you?)... kept on bragging about the servive I haven't had... i did not complain about it, why should you!....

You twisted the point of my original post. Than you showed to the world that there is a reason to be suspicious about my purchase, like that anyone should care. You questioned the dealer sending me a synch cable?................ Do you hear yourself? Dont you even remotely think that its possible that I actually I requested for cable in advance, (suggestion-curtesy by a fellow member that "actually" was very helpful in a different thread).

Ok, shell we please close the doors.

Thank you.

Regards,

Edit: please, I'm here to just learn, read about B&o stuff and enjoy the beolabs..... peacefully.

Re: Unpacking Beolab 5

Leslie — Tue, 15 Nov 2011 18:25:46 GMT

soundproof:
Poor Maab

Poor Maab? If I was him I already asked the moderating team to remove this ridiculous "soap"! Nobody wants to read this kind of threads.

If people wanna argue do it by PM

Re: Unpacking Beolab 5

soundproof — Tue, 15 Nov 2011 18:05:16 GMT

Poor Maab. He buys a pair of nice speakers, looks forward to using them, doesn't want to do anything wrong in setting them up, and gets hit by an avalanche of derision by KOS, starting from post nr. 1 from him.

Congratulations with your new speakers, Maab. Hope you're enjoying them.

Re: Unpacking Beolab 5

KingOfSnake — Tue, 15 Nov 2011 16:49:07 GMT

Nice post Neil - but having a go at members of Beoworld? Surely the supplying Dealer would have advised of any special way open a cardboard box if they weren't there to open the box themselves for the customer, or in the alternative instructions would have been on the box. One thing is for sure, I would like to think that nobody has tried to turn a palletised cardboard box upside down in the past to open a Beolab 5 box. My last post too.

Re: Unpacking Beolab 5

Neil — Tue, 15 Nov 2011 16:32:40 GMT

Oh dear,

I seem to have got caught up in all of this. This is my very last post on the issue(s).

Can I say quite categorically that it was neither my intension nor my wish to be part of a vendetta or witchhunt. I do not know (or wish to know) what has gone before. My posting was merely based on an observation that 2 re-sellers were suddenly "having a go" at recent members of Beoworld for asking a straightforward question in one case and winning a prize draw in the other. Hardly a warm welcome, and I though inappropriate from such distinguished members who are in the privileged position of being highly experienced in matters B&O.

To both JBG and KofS I wish to express my regret at perhaps being instrumental in fanning the flames as it were.

I sincerely hope we can all return to the reason we are all here, the celebration of all things B&O on a usually excellent and civilised forum.

Regards to all,

Neil.

Re: Unpacking Beolab 5

KingOfSnake — Tue, 15 Nov 2011 16:09:10 GMT

It didn't shock me, if I am being equally honest. If anyone else had questioned the integrity of a post then they would not have received the vitriolic abuse I have. I didn't expect anyone to be supportive and thankfully I was wrong.

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Questioning the authenticity of a post - how to open a cardboard box, perhaps I turn Beolab 5 upside down etc. - is turned into ridiculing someone........... and then after apologising to the guy for any offence caused and offering to assist with his purchase of Beolab 5's and a sync cable I get this, from a person who has never even spoken to me in his life and makes personal comments and false accusations as if he has some special third-party knowledge.

'simply leave you to continue posting small minded remarks' (SUCH AS!) Your user name suits you & your attitude perfectly BTW.... but I simply don't care for people of your ilk

Pot Kettle Black

But lets move on, nobody has died. Medogsfat may appear to want to live in the past having never met someone and drawing his own conclusions, life is too short.

(BTW I never made KOS up, apparently it is a legend of an (Velvet?) Underground track if you like that sort of thing.)

Re: Unpacking Beolab 5

moxxey — Tue, 15 Nov 2011 15:44:36 GMT

Medogsfat:

I will not reply to any of KOS posts on this but I will excercise my right to defend myself, this right is not something that is automatically taken away with moderator status.

I'm not going to reply in detail to this Chris. I suggest that we draw a line under this. Your comments/views - as a moderator and representative of this board - have shocked me, if I'm being honest.

Let's get back to discussing B&O, 'eh?

Re: Unpacking Beolab 5

Medogsfat — Tue, 15 Nov 2011 15:17:48 GMT

moxxey:

Medogsfat:

To the OP (Maab) I would strongly suggest ignoring anything Ian G.... - sorry - King of Snake has to say as he is simply bitter towards Beoworld & and takes pleasure in creating ill feeling amongst the membership

Crikey, this is worse than what Ian has written, IMHO. Talk about stirring up trouble that isn't required.

I'm going to make a formal complain to Lee and am seriously going to question my involvement with this board if this is the type of response you will get from a moderator.

Medogsfat: I'm not sure you are aware of the legalities of posting on a forum in the UK, but as a moderator your words are effectively representative of the board, Lee and ultimately LifeStyleAV. By bringing Ian's work situation in to your argument, you could be held responsible for loss of trade for making comments like that. As a moderator, I'd strongly suggest you take a look at recent libal laws which changed recently to include words written on a public forum.

OK, I'll apologise for bringing Ian's work situation into this IF & ONLY IF you can show me exactly how & when I did this. You can obviously read far more into this than I wrote???

What has LifeStyle AV got to do with anything? Beoworld has total independance from them, it is self supporting & the only input from that company is prize donations & advertising sponsorship (along with others) am I a mouthpiece for SoundsHeavenly, Hygge Living & STB Brackets too?

Other than that, I stand by every word I said & I'm sure KOS is right that the past is exactly that & time to let sleeping dogs lie.. etc... etc.. To forget what went before would benefit only one person on this site.

Oh & for the record I am not in the slightest bit interested in the rights & wrongs regarding Maab's purchase & what he should & shouldn't have received as part of the package - KOS may be right or he may be wrong, but as the OP has refrained from this topic lately (who can blame him) we may never know the exact truth. I am sure a lesson was learned if he was sold short.

My problem is the manner in which KOS first ridiculed Maab & then continued to badger him over a private deal which had nothing to do with his original question. It was made obvious that Maab wanted nothing more to do with KOS after the intitial upset yet still he persisted on bringing into question how much he paid & what he got for his money.

As I have already stated - I will not reply to any of KOS posts on this but I will excercise my right to defend myself, this right is not something that is automatically taken away with moderator status.

Chris.

Re: Unpacking Beolab 5

KingOfSnake — Tue, 15 Nov 2011 07:48:46 GMT

Broad shoulders JBG but cheers - bemused what all the fuss is about in all honesty. Left myself open to the 'You've got a Vendetta against Beoworld' Brigade though didn't I? Should have kept mum lol. The only thing that slightly miffs me was that I suggested to Lee the strapline 'For Everything Bang & Olufsen' for the site - slightly modded neverthless but I want royalties!!!!! LOL.

(***This a light-hearted joke, I do not want royalties, it was tongue-in-cheek and I apologise to any member who is offended by such banter***)

What annoyed me was that I just delivered a pair of Beolab 5 to a customer in Rotterdam - one dead on arrival - so I was back the next week struggling setting them up with a third party amp and a sync cable. Who would have ever thought you need to press RADIO to get the blooming things to work with a third party amp, seemingly ridiculous IMHO. Left a happy customer though. Hence I thought I could offer expert advice to Maab but sadly it was thrown back in my face.

I just found it strange that on an equally new pair of Beolab 5 the franchised Dealer wasn't there to offer as much support and assistance to Maab and similarly as you have pointed out, for a premium product dumped at the door I think it unacceptable. I didn't think a franchised Dealer was allowed to sell things in this manner without that all-important element of service but perhaps Maab negotiated a good price and we do not know all the details - still curious why there was a sync cable though.

I take it from Neil's comment on the unboxing topic that you have put noses out of joint with a remark concerning the prize Draw? No idea what it was but as Moxxey has pointed out, the written word is more misinterpreted than the spoken word (where you can draw on peoples expressions/and or body movements/hand signals/number of fingers sticking up) and I will bear that in mind when making light-hearted comments in the future (honest).

Re: Unpacking Beolab 5

moxxey — Tue, 15 Nov 2011 06:52:58 GMT

joeyboygolf:

If I had just spent £10k plus on a pair of speakers and the dealer just dumped them off on me, he would likely get them straight back with my demand for a refund.

That happened to me through a Sony dealer, many years ago (2001?). Ordered a very heavy widescreen 32" CRT TV. Dealer told me I'd get a 15% discount as it was on the shop floor - fair enough, it looked brand new.

Dealer advertised free delivery and that they'd spend an hour setting things up, taking away boxes etc.

Dealer turned up with 60Kg TV and promptly dumped it in my hallway in a HUGE box. They told me that the setup wasn't included as I'd received a discount! Fair to say I struggled to get it out of the box and on the glass stand. I then had about 5 metres of cardboard to get rid of.

I'd already bought hi-fi separates from the dealer and a Sony laptop! It wasn't as if I was a new customer.

Fair to say I never bought from that dealer again....even though I used to see the owner around Bath and he'd regularly say "hello". I think he was genuinely confused why I stopped going in the store. I couldn't be bothered to explain.

Re: Unpacking Beolab 5

joeyboygolf — Tue, 15 Nov 2011 05:51:32 GMT

Keep going King of Snake, don't let the b.....ds grind you down.

If I had just spent £10k plus on a pair of speakers and the dealer just dumped them off on me, he would likely get them straight back with my demand for a refund.

I would expect the dealer would want to install them, preferably included in the price or, at the very least, as part of a negotiated deal.

With regard to the unboxing topic, I too believe that the taking/posting of pictures of items being deboxed is a bit weird and your comments on the subject were suitably light hearted. I chuckled to myself and hoped that they would be taken in the manner in which, I am sure, they were intended. Alas, some of the more precious flowers on the site took offence and you have suffered some undesireable reaction with unjustified muck raking from all and sundry.

Others, like Moxxey have become involved, given their opinion on the subject (Whatever next? On a forum, the cheeky gits!!) and been similarly treated.

No doubt this thread will soon be the subject of the usual "Room 101" treatment, which is dished out to most contentious posts on this forum.

Written by "The gentleman from East Anglia"

Re: Unpacking Beolab 5

bayerische — Tue, 15 Nov 2011 04:47:43 GMT

Luke :

Hey Maab, would love to see the final set up pics if you care to post. Sorry your thread seems to have been a bit derailed. Hoping the other discussion will be taken offline or to PM now so that we can continue on your thread-

I have the same speakers at home, they are truly a pleasure to listen to as well as look at.

Yes!

Maab, if you are still around, it would be nice to see your setup. If it's finished.

Re: Unpacking Beolab 5

Luke — Tue, 15 Nov 2011 04:33:25 GMT

Hey Maab, would love to see the final set up pics if you care to post. Sorry your thread seems to have been a bit derailed. Hoping the other discussion will be taken offline or to PM now so that we can continue on your thread-

I have the same speakers at home, they are truly a pleasure to listen to as well as look at.