General Forum

Re: So maybe now they'll support ALAC...

TripEnglish — Sat, 05 Nov 2011 10:00:10 GMT

That's really my point. I'm not making excuses, but rather wondering if the progression of features on certain platforms isn't, to some extent, out of their hands? That would make the situation worse, not better, in my opinion. If they're in control, then they can add features as they see fit. The fact that other devices in the brand can do it and they can't make one wonder.

Re: So maybe now they'll support ALAC...

Chrisreunion — Sat, 05 Nov 2011 00:12:00 GMT

The most incredible thing for me is that my BeoSound 2 could play gapless, so does my BeoPort with Linkplayer or BMLink, so can a BeoSound 8 with an Ipod, in others words the most expensive BeoSound cannot do what the cheaper ones can...so why bother "upgrading" if it turns out to a downgrade in listening pleasure??

And yes, my question nr 3 was about NRADIO displaying track & artist names , something impossible in BeoPort PC version, BeoPlayer app, and BS5 as far as I can remember (everytime I was looking at it in shops, the station's name was displayed, not track/artist).This is also a feature available on the rest of the world's netradio players, and one that changes regularly the display, making it more "alive"...and useful

Re: So maybe now they'll support ALAC...

jk1002 — Fri, 04 Nov 2011 21:49:34 GMT

I second this.

There is no excuse for the missing gapless playing. This pops up every now and then, in fact i was hoping that the flac support would adress this since its lossless like wma where it seems to be working.

Note that the gapless that we are so used to is actually a feature which on pods is activated trough an id3 tag if i am not mistaken

Re: So maybe now they'll support ALAC...

mbee — Fri, 04 Nov 2011 19:26:29 GMT

Trip, don't try to search excuses for the inexcusable...

If it's not on the Encore, it's not because of a communication standard (DLNA or what you want) : it's because it's not programmed well, that's all. Owners of the BS5 had to wait a lot for this simple feature, which is event not a feature, it's just "how it's supposed to work", and now they do the same error with the Encore.

It's not DLNA/Upnp which is the problem, as even with direct connexion of a USB hard drive, it doesn't work. B&O can't continue to sell products with major flaws like that, it's killing them, doing exactly what B&O haters say : style over substance.

With the BS5, B&O had the excuse of using a full Windows PC and relying on the Windows Media Player platform, and its drawbacks with "non-Microsoft filetypes". But now with the Encore, it's a full B&O-specified architecture.

Without gapless playback, the technology can be compared to a Kikinoko/bad chinese disposable MP3 player, not to other expansive HIFI systems.

It's like building a new supercar and saying "oh well, you have the horsepower of a Ferrari, you have the style of a Ferrari... But you cannot steer, as we don't understand how a steering wheel works! Maybe we will add this possibility later"

Re: So maybe now they'll support ALAC...

TripEnglish — Fri, 04 Nov 2011 17:57:13 GMT

This may be a seperate discussion altogether, but:

It seems to me that B&O are not driving their own bus on this stuff. Many features seem to be dependant on the standards (UPnP, AirPlay, DLNA, etc.) that B&O adopt and less so on their own ideal set of features and capabilities.

I wonder if things like gapless playback are somehow dependant on portion of the SW that B&O are not in direct control of. It has proven to be an annoyance for classical music listeners (who already have to deal with MOTS, which doesn't lend itself to classical and opera the way it does to other genres).

Re: So maybe now they'll support ALAC...

mbee — Fri, 04 Nov 2011 12:32:03 GMT

Totally agree with you Chris, they're making a lot of adverts about how good it is to have a "high end MP3 player" like the Encore, how "audiophile" it is, and it can not support this simple feature, which is just totally irritating (I stay polite) not to have.

So there are 2 things that makes me wait and see before buying an Encore :
1. The gapless playback (at least of FLAC, ALAC would be great too)
2. The lack of the interface to "link" its BeoNet to my BV (a BeoNet to ML converter, or, better, a new link module for BV...) I can wait for the new "circular BeoNet IR eye for link rooms"

By the way, chris, what was the question N°3??? Was it something like "can the Encore display the song information of tracks played in a webradio?" or something like "can the Encore display webradio logo?"

Re: So maybe now they'll support ALAC...

Chrisreunion — Fri, 04 Nov 2011 10:36:47 GMT

Going back to the original topic (ALAC playback), below is a reply I just received today from B&O customer service:

Thread de discussion
Réponse (Charlotte Pennerup Melton)	04/11/2011 03:20 PM
Dear Mr. Georget, We are pleased to see that you are interested in purchasing our BeoSound 5 Encore and we will be pleased to answer your questions: 1) The BeoSound 5 Encore is not capable of playing gapless tracks. 2) The BeoSound 5 Encore cannot play ALAC (Apple Lossless) files, but now, after Apple have made this "open source", it might be possible that a software is released in the furture, which will make this possible. 3) If N.Radio station is broadcasting this, the BeoSound 5 Encore will show it. Otherwise it is not possible. 4) If albums are added to a coloured favorite you can play all albums in the favorite, without MOTS enabled Kind regards, Bang & Olufsen a/s Charlotte Pennerup Melton Customer Service (Denmark)

So, keep your fingers crossed!

Now I hope they are working on gapless playback, however it seems to be for the distant future, not the near one unfortunately..I'm quite surprised people don't complain more about gaps when playing a Mozart symphony or an album from Enigma..it drives me crazy!

Re: So maybe now they'll support ALAC...

Carolpa — Thu, 03 Nov 2011 01:39:00 GMT

mbee:
but now you're struck with a file that only plays with Foobar?

with a plug-in you can play AND rip de SACD-iso into WAV or FLAC

(there are SACD-iso's around .....)

Re: So maybe now they'll support ALAC...

mbee — Wed, 02 Nov 2011 19:07:43 GMT

Wow! That IS really tricky!!!

As I don't own lots of SACDs, and as finding a 1st gen PS3 and managing to downgrade to <3.55 is close to impossible, I will just hope that the Qobuz Studio Masters library expands...

By the way : you managed to rip DSD from SACD, but now you're struck with a file that only plays with Foobar? I mean : there is still no available solution for converting your file to FLAC (or something else more supported by hardware decoders)?

Re: So maybe now they'll support ALAC...

Carolpa — Wed, 02 Nov 2011 00:59:45 GMT

mbee:

I didn't know that it was possible to rip the DSD layer of a SACD... What software (and maybe hardware) do you use to do that?

it is tricky because you must have a PS3 from the first generation (SACD capable) AND the firmware must be <=3.55

see this site for the sw: http://code.google.com/p/sacd-ripper/

a SACD iso file can be played and ripped in Foobar2000 after installing a plug-in to Hires PCM

Re: So maybe now they'll support ALAC...

mbee — Tue, 01 Nov 2011 19:11:32 GMT

Carolpa:
But for now an alternative is ripping DVD (Video / Audio), ripping Blurays and even ripping the DSD layer of a SACD. I already have a collection of about 1200 tracks in 24bit (up to 192kHz) resolution.

Hi Carolpa!

I didn't know that it was possible to rip the DSD layer of a SACD... What software (and maybe hardware) do you use to do that?

By the way, if someone wants to try Qobuz, here is a code to be sponsorized by myself :
http://www.qobuz.com/authentification?parrain=8339-87317

you get :
- 4 free albums (so that you can try Studio Masters quality without having to pay...)
- 5% reduction
- 24h free streaming (their streaming offer is not the best I know, but it's worth a try)

Re: So maybe now they'll support ALAC...

Russ — Sun, 30 Oct 2011 09:33:52 GMT

bayerische:

Carolpa:

EdouardG:

Hi guys,

More than lossless, Qobuz make it possible to buy albums in a Studio Masters quality too.

Thanks again Marc for making me discover this website, now I don't buy music from iTunes anymore

Cheers,

I never understood the iTunes hype, anyway. For some Euro's/Dollars more one could/can buy the CD. And then one can rip it in any format you prefer!

The price - quality ratio of iTunes files is to low if one compares it with a CD.

Not defending iTunes, as IMHO they should have given the lossless option 2-3 years ago.

However, iTunes or online music stores are great by offering the possibility to buy one song, not the whole record. They offer previews or should I say "prelistening" before you buy, great for finding new music. Everything in the store ~20 million songs are always available and never "out of stock". No brick and mortar music store could ever come close to 20 million songs in store, it would take over 1 million cd's to do that.

IMHO the quality of the current iTunes file is very good, not perfect but very good.

A couple of points here, if I may. To the above comments let me say that in any field of interest or fetish, wether it be wine, wristwatches, automobiles or hi-fi audio, the vast majority is not terribly interested in discovering, much less buying, the very best there is. They are rather more interested in convenience and value (real or imagined.)

Can we all agree that the benefits of a lossless audio file are wasted on the headsets that Apple gives away with their iProducts? Similarly, in an Audi A7 cruising along at 100kph, I imagine that the ambient noise-floor is somewhere north of 60db due to wind- and road-noise, so where does that put my precious 110db S-N/R? Balanced against the sheer joy of sitting down at the keyboard and finding that one track you've always wanted, clicking a mouse a couple of times, grabbing my keys, unplugging my iPod and dashing off to my car to go do the things I really want to do while listening to my new song? The iTunes store has been life changing, and utterly satisfactory, for millions of people. We're a minority with demanding tastes, and those tastes presented daunting technical challenges to the industry a decade ago. They're getting to us. Deal with it.

To Trip's point: Obviously local storage has alwasy been a key issue, and one that is being dealt with by the storage equivalent of Moore's Law. On the other hand, band-width has been a far more difficult problem to overcome. And one that neither Apple, nor the recording industry can really solve from their end. The world-wide hodge-podge patchwork of service providers is struggling to deal with demand, and even threatening to 'throttle' individual user's. A sudden huge influx of lossless audio will only make that situation worse.

I think a little patience and pragmatic thinking may be in order.

Re: So maybe now they'll support ALAC...

bayerische — Sun, 30 Oct 2011 08:22:40 GMT

Carolpa:

EdouardG:

Hi guys,

More than lossless, Qobuz make it possible to buy albums in a Studio Masters quality too.

Thanks again Marc for making me discover this website, now I don't buy music from iTunes anymore

Cheers,

I never understood the iTunes hype, anyway. For some Euro's/Dollars more one could/can buy the CD. And then one can rip it in any format you prefer!

The price - quality ratio of iTunes files is to low if one compares it with a CD.

Not defending iTunes, as IMHO they should have given the lossless option 2-3 years ago.

However, iTunes or online music stores are great by offering the possibility to buy one song, not the whole record. They offer previews or should I say "prelistening" before you buy, great for finding new music. Everything in the store ~20 million songs are always available and never "out of stock". No brick and mortar music store could ever come close to 20 million songs in store, it would take over 1 million cd's to do that.

IMHO the quality of the current iTunes file is very good, not perfect but very good.

Re: So maybe now they'll support ALAC...

soundproof — Sun, 30 Oct 2011 05:58:08 GMT

bayerische:

soundproof:

Puncher:

I don't suppose iTunes is about to start selling lossless music???

It is, according to some pretty convincing chatter.

Keeping fingers crossed!!! Hoping for a one sum uppgrade to lossless quality for existing purchases!

Here's an article about the majors planning to abandon the CD-format next year. They'll sell through downloads and streams - which then sets a clear context to what happened to ALAC. Which is as much as I should say on the topic. :-)

http://www.side-line.com/news_comments.php?id=46980_0_2_0_C

Re: So maybe now they'll support ALAC...

Carolpa — Sun, 30 Oct 2011 01:32:24 GMT

EdouardG:

you won't (easily) find any Studio Masters cd's on the market...that's why Qobuz is a Great alternative.

for sure this will be the future.

But for now an alternative is ripping DVD (Video / Audio), ripping Blurays and even ripping the DSD layer of a SACD. I already have a collection of about 1200 tracks in 24bit (up to 192kHz) resolution.