General Forum

Re: Apple's "AirPlay" and B&O

OKF — Fri, 11 Mar 2011 04:28:42 GMT

Again your sum up is a (negative) interpretation and I do not read it that way!

It is not bad to disagree and discuss but I think 'beojeff' perfectly described it when he said that there is a difference between expressing an opinion and being argumentative. Maybe you think about that sentence a moment before you answer that again.

Re: Apple's "AirPlay" and B&O

Electrified — Fri, 11 Mar 2011 01:06:14 GMT

OKF:

Thanks, I agree and have tried to explain that but was not successful. I think there is not a lot of choices so I do what you do, be a dickhead andbuy this terrible Ipad2 :-)

beojeff:
I agree with you BeoFab, too. I've encountered similar issues with Electrified in the past. Everyone is entitled to an opinion, but there's a difference between expressing an opinion and being argumentative. This is a friendly forum and posters should be courteous and respectful.

To sum up, it's bad form to disagree with anyone, and it's especially bad form to point out that something is a logical fallacy. If so, we will resort to ad hominems and strawman argumentation (never called someone a dickhead, you're taking this way too personally).

Re: Apple's "AirPlay" and B&O

beojeff — Thu, 10 Mar 2011 18:57:54 GMT

BeoFab:

Electrified,

I can tell you love a good argument but in my humble opinion sometimes is wiser to stop arguing.

Now as for the "Airplay" thing which by the way is THE topic in this thread I think that any new technology is welcome "open" or "closed" which brings enterteinment and comfort and in the end is the user's option to get hooked or not by it. As a personal opinion in my case I don't really care that much about "airplay" but this weekend I will be buying my Ipad2, why? because is the most affordable piece of entertaining, good design and nice technology that I can buy for just 500 bucks, that is a pleasure to use, see and enjoy. Kind of like with most of the B&O stuff but considerably more affordable and ubiquitous.

I agree with you BeoFab, too. I've encountered similar issues with Electrified in the past. Everyone is entitled to an opinion, but there's a difference between expressing an opinion and being argumentative. This is a friendly forum and posters should be courteous and respectful.

Re: Apple's "AirPlay" and B&O

OKF — Thu, 10 Mar 2011 16:28:17 GMT

Thanks, I agree and have tried to explain that but was not successful. I think there is not a lot of choices so I do what you do, be a dickhead andbuy this terrible Ipad2 :-)

Re: Apple's "AirPlay" and B&O

BeoFab — Thu, 10 Mar 2011 13:52:57 GMT

Electrified,

I can tell you love a good argument but in my humble opinion sometimes is wiser to stop arguing.

Now as for the "Airplay" thing which by the way is THE topic in this thread I think that any new technology is welcome "open" or "closed" which brings enterteinment and comfort and in the end is the user's option to get hooked or not by it. As a personal opinion in my case I don't really care that much about "airplay" but this weekend I will be buying my Ipad2, why? because is the most affordable piece of entertaining, good design and nice technology that I can buy for just 500 bucks, that is a pleasure to use, see and enjoy. Kind of like with most of the B&O stuff but considerably more affordable and ubiquitous.

Re: Apple's "AirPlay" and B&O

Electrified — Thu, 10 Mar 2011 13:24:24 GMT

OKF:
I would not use the pre if I would not know what it means...

If so, you just don't make sense.

OKF:
I do not know the word disprove and was under the impression that is was a misspelling - and you see this is what I meant with you interpret something into something...and also trying to give it back e.g the not reading.

Well, if you don't know the words, you're hardly the one to accuse me of reading something into what you write.

OKF:
Yes I took the last posting (not the one I am ansering to now) personal because you are repeating or stressing this meinstrem issue..anyhow lets stop this discussion here otherwise I get angry and I do not want this.

Take a deep breath and step away from any keyboard if you get angry over someone disagreeing with you on the internet.

Re: Apple's "AirPlay" and B&O

OKF — Thu, 10 Mar 2011 13:03:49 GMT

I would not use the pre if I would not know what it means...

I do not know the word disprove and was under the impression that is was a misspelling - and you see this is what I meant with you interpret something into something...and also trying to give it back e.g the not reading.

Yes I took the last posting (not the one I am ansering to now) personal because you are repeating or stressing this meinstrem issue..anyhow lets stop this discussion here otherwise I get angry and I do not want this.

Re: Apple's "AirPlay" and B&O

Electrified — Thu, 10 Mar 2011 11:57:09 GMT

OKF:
it is not possible to discuss that with you any further as you 'interpret' to many things into what I do write and translate them to something that I did not mean. Just read what I write

LOL, I really did read what you wrote. Hence my question as to whether or not you understood what the "pre" meant.

OKF:
Also you state all the time that you are right and everybody else is wrong.

No I don't. Don't make up things.

OKF:
I do not want to to approve or disapprove anything

Speaking of not reading. I never said "disapprove". I said disprove. A world of difference.

OKF:
Anyhow I am also dumb and stupid to your opinion and I can live with that.

Haha! If you take it that personal, I guess you're right that it's useless having a discussion with you.

Re: Apple's "AirPlay" and B&O

OKF — Thu, 10 Mar 2011 11:49:55 GMT

it is not possible to discuss that with you any further as you 'interpret' to many things into what I do write and translate them to something that I did not mean. Just read what I write. Also you state all the time that you are right and everybody else is wrong. I do not want to to approve or disapprove anything. Anyhow I am also dumb and stupid to your opinion and I can live with that.

Re: Apple's "AirPlay" and B&O

Electrified — Thu, 10 Mar 2011 11:34:36 GMT

OKF:
I think Laptops look terrible [...]

LOL, I see. I prefer laptops as tools compared to desktops. But then again, I buy laptops to be able to work out and about.

and common pre pc devices like the ipad do so as well.

Do you understand what "pre" means? That statement above just doesn't make sense, apart from the fact that you don't like laptops, but think that the choice for people are between and iPad and a laptop.

OKF:
15 mio ignorant people and much more to come because we are talking 1 year only? Well, well I would agree that the majority of people is sort of dumb but a certain percentage is not. Even 5% of these are still 750.000. I think the MCD comparison is lacking of any similarity. Comparing it with a car or any other lets say technical device would be appropriate.

All that is still an appeal to popularity. It really doesn't matter that you just add more figures, it's still an appeal to popularity which doesn't disprove anything I've said.

OKF:
My arguments are: it looks pretty and the overall design is clever, it is userfriendly, it connects up to a certain amount. I am not saying it is better then anything else because I do not know. But designwise it is the best I can find.

Designwise it's crap if you want to use it as a remote. It's a twohanded operation and it's huge.

I really can't see you have moved on from the argument that "it's pretty, hence it's the best I can find".

OKF:
I never in my live owned an Apple product but Ipad 2 will be the first proper one, since I bought an Ipod Classsic for my car 6 months ago and last week an Ipod touch for my new B+O setup. You seem to forget that most people would not be able to jailbreak and most people would not be able to setup and opperate a NAS device. This is what e.g. ATV is for. Easy, cheap and self explaining.

As I said, hype and ignorance:They aren't even aware that they're being tied into a closed eco system, but boy, '"everyone" has one, so I need to get one too'.

Re: Apple's "AirPlay" and B&O

OKF — Thu, 10 Mar 2011 10:34:04 GMT

I think Laptops look terrible and common pre pc devices like the ipad do so as well.

Yes you are locked in to something same as with B+O in the very main!

15 mio ignorant people and much more to come because we are talking 1 year only? Well, well I would agree that the majority of people is sort of dumb but a certain percentage is not. Even 5% of these are still 750.000. I think the MCD comparison is lacking of any similarity. Comparing it with a car or any other lets say technical device would be appropriate.

My arguments are: it looks pretty and the overall design is clever, it is userfriendly, it connects up to a certain amount. I am not saying it is better then anything else because I do not know. But designwise it is the best I can find.

I never in my live owned an Apple product but Ipad 2 will be the first proper one, since I bought an Ipod Classsic for my car 6 months ago and last week an Ipod touch for my new B+O setup. You seem to forget that most people would not be able to jailbreak and most people would not be able to setup and opperate a NAS device. This is what e.g. ATV is for. Easy, cheap and self explaining.

Re: Apple's "AirPlay" and B&O

Electrified — Thu, 10 Mar 2011 08:07:13 GMT

OKF:
I totally agree with you in general but when you want to use the Ipod and the IPad e.g. in a B+O environment and get most out of these things you may end up with a jailbreak of the ATV

Yes, and as I said, buying a product and having to jailbreak/hack it to get most out of it, is not really something I want to support.

OKF:
A think pad and all this Pre-PC-Devices look so horrible that I prefer to buy an Ipad now

I have no idea what you mean. A thinkpad is PC, as is MacBook. There's nothing "pre-PC" about it.I chose my Thinkpads because it's a tool and the best I could find. I don't buy my tools to be used as eye candy, so the "looks so horrible" comment is really weird too.

When it comes to my Squeezeboxes, all you see is the remote. Buying into the iPad would mean a humongous remote if used as such, it would entail buying into Apple-lockdown - hook, line and sinker.

I don't get why the best argument against much more consumer choice always seems to boil down to "but I prefer pretty things".

OKF:
15 mio sold Ipad's within a year should say something...

Hype and ignorance? How many meals are sold by McDonald's each year? It really isn't an argument that X number of people have bought into it. My argument is not whether or not the iPad will fail, but an argument against lock-downs and tie-ins. Appeals to popularity is very rarely not a logical fallacy.

Apart from the telly, which I bought for two reasons (It is the best sound I can find in a small LCD tv, and secondary, as far as tellies goes, it's pretty) my gear is bought on spec and whether or not it will do what I want it to do. The latter thing could possibly be moved to "spec" too, but you get the idea.

My B&O audio gear is very limited, as not many of them live up to what I want. Regardless of how pretty they are. I used to own BL5's, but moving into an apartment meant I had to get rid of them. I bought them because they're excellent speakers, and because they're more wife-friendly than most threeway far-field studio monitors.

The reason I probably want the Encore is because it might, just might (in time) surpass the user friendliness of the Squeezebox.

Oh, and why do I have Squeezeboxes instead of Sonos? Well, they have better audio quality than the Sonos by far.

In short, your entire argument boils down to "it looks pretty, and since its popular at the moment, it must be better than anything else".

Re: Apple's "AirPlay" and B&O

OKF — Thu, 10 Mar 2011 07:16:36 GMT

I totally agree with you in general but when you want to use the Ipod and the IPad e.g. in a B+O environment and get most out of these things you may end up with a jailbreak of the ATV. The consumer does not need jailbreaks and is happy with what he gets for just 100 Euros and can also integrate Ipod/pad into B+O in full. A think pad and all this Pre-PC-Devices look so horrible that I prefer to buy an Ipad now. The reason to buy overpriced B+O for me was always the design and the linkability in the second place. So Apple in a way does the same. They do clever products in excellent design slightly overpriced. 15 mio sold Ipad's within a year should say something...

Re: Apple's "AirPlay" and B&O

Electrified — Thu, 10 Mar 2011 06:12:23 GMT

OKF:

Ah I see what you mean but when you jailbreak ATV you should be fine with NAS.. I have ordered a NAS myself and have the intention to jailbreak te ATV but the NAS does support Itunes so it may make things a bit easier.

LOL, the mere idea that it's okay to buy a product you have to hack/jailbreak to function as it ought to shows just how much Apple is attempting to limit the users/buyers.

None of my products have had to be "jailbroken" or anything of the kind. They play nice across the board. Of course, to be able to read my NAS with my Mac, I have had to install a plugin (Edit: on the Mac) so it can read NTFS+ drives. But really, I seldomly use my Mac, but it is nice to be able to read what's on the NAS with it.

Of course, afterwards, I have to remove all the small annoying files that OSX drops everywhere on connected drives. Everytime I have connected my Mac to it and after I have removed the files, it makes me happy I have moved on and are using Thinkpads these days.

But, anyway, if I have to hack or jailbreak a product to make use of it, I'd rather be buying something that doesn't need it from the get-go.

Re: Apple's "AirPlay" and B&O

OKF — Thu, 10 Mar 2011 06:04:11 GMT

Ah I see what you mean but when you jailbreak ATV you should be fine with NAS.. I have ordered a NAS myself and have the intention to jailbreak te ATV but the NAS does support Itunes so it may make things a bit easier.