General Forum

Re: How hard is Bang & Olufsen hit ?

benjnz — Mon, 29 Jun 2009 18:20:44 GMT

Are their shares worth buying, well generally the rule in share purchases - for those of us of in the normal purchasing world would be buy what you can afford to loose.

It's generally regarded as a great time to buy shares in companies now, but only if you hold long term 5-10 years. If I had the spare cash I'd certainly be buying B&O stock

Re: How hard is Bang & Olufsen hit ?

erg4000 — Mon, 29 Jun 2009 15:09:54 GMT

BeoSound 5 was a big disappointment for me because it has no disc player. Otherwise it could have been a perfect replacement for my Beocenter 2. Considering how long B&O's product development takes, I would suggest to forget all kinds of disc or HD players and focus on these things:

Speakers: Beolab 9's are easily competing within the high-end league.

AV receivers: The Beosystem 3 is a perfect integration of B&O speakers with different kinds of media players, game consoles and displays - all controlled by a Beo4.

TV sets: Integrated TV sets based on Beosystem 3 but with newer screen technology (LCD and Panasonic's ultraslim NeoPDP plasmas)

Re: How hard is Bang & Olufsen hit ?

Kokomo — Mon, 29 Jun 2009 01:54:57 GMT

Apple are far better at talking to their customers directly and resolving issues, I've found. B&O aren't. They completely rely on their dealers. They do not and won't talk directly to their customers, issue an apology, call to see if their relationship with their dealer is causing issues and so on. Apple do. You can call Apple!

Do B&O still run the Saturday morning telephone help service?

A couple of years or so back I rang them a couple of times for advice which was very forthcoming. It was succinct, but sadly totally incorrect!

Re: How hard is Bang & Olufsen hit ?

XavierItzmann — Sun, 28 Jun 2009 21:41:24 GMT

bayerische:
I understand not wanting to have a BV9 or BL5's in storage, but Beo5 and ML cable...? I found it a bit strange

I bought PL cable in December and March. Standard lenghts, 10m.

The cable took 3 weeks to arrive each time, because it comes from Poland. Each and every time one orders some. This is speaker cable, for crying out loud.

Re: How hard is Bang & Olufsen hit ?

XavierItzmann — Sun, 28 Jun 2009 21:18:47 GMT

The_Beonic_Man:
you have to question why they are coming out with their first handsfree landline (speaker phone capable) so late? This technology is ancient. What the heck have they been thinking?

Indeed.

Furthermore, the pace at which people are abandoning their fixed landlines and going mobile-only is nothing short of stunning. It is troublesome to see B&O jumping into a dying maket.

Re: How hard is Bang & Olufsen hit ?

TripEnglish — Sun, 28 Jun 2009 20:58:45 GMT

moxxey:

TripEnglish:

Not really defending us as I agree that some Danes need to pull their heads out of their a$ses, but I'm as sick of hearing about Apple as though it was handed down from the Gods as some forum members are of hearing the "take our defects and say thank you" line from some posters.

I agree Trip. I know of a large number of colleagues who have had to return and replace their iPhone.

However, three differences:

1) the Apple products are very cheap, in comparison. We're talking sw problems with some of B&Os premier products.

2) there are many many more Apple products (than B&O kit), so statistically you're likely to find people who have had some kind of problem with Apple kit

3) Apple are far better at talking to their customers directly and resolving issues, I've found. B&O aren't. They completely rely on their dealers. They do not and won't talk directly to their customers, issue an apology, call to see if their relationship with their dealer is causing issues and so on. Apple do. You can call Apple!

I think you've diagnosed the problem right there, Moxxey. The experience in the stores is not only spotty, but (and I'm not just going on the info here on the forum) almost universally sub-par. I can only imagine how many people are actually less likely to buy our product AFTER being in a store!

As an owner/operator I hear about experiences from my customers about visits to other retailers both nearby and around the world and I just sigh. And here I'm extra frustrated with Apple at the moment, but every time I go into the store my blood pressure goes down, not up!

We spend a lot of time talking about the products and prices and those are things that will remain contested, but someone needs to crack the whip and start expropriating stores and revoking dealer licenses!

Re: How hard is Bang & Olufsen hit ?

vikinger — Sun, 28 Jun 2009 16:27:33 GMT

Talking of strange responses from dealers, I asked about a Beo4 wall holder when last in my local store. They could only find a used one in the basement and offered it to me at a discount.

Two weeks later I get a thank you letter detailing the guarantee that comes with my new purchase! Fortunately there's not much that can go wrong with a holder although I was warned not to drop the Beo4 into it as it could break the holder base and go straight through! Another (un)fit for purpose product??????

Graham

Re: How hard is Bang & Olufsen hit ?

jk1002 — Sun, 28 Jun 2009 16:14:39 GMT

>>They stubbornly refuse to interact or talk to their users regarding any issues<<

My sales guy called me up 6 month after I received my TV asking if everything is OK with the product. Now one can argue he was looking to upsell but I bought a BV8 BC2 from him and he knows about my BL3/BL2 and BS9000 so what is there more to upsell? BS5 wasn't in stores back then and now that it is he doesn't call ..... Speaks again for how disorganized they are .....

Cheers

Re: How hard is Bang & Olufsen hit ?

moxxey — Sun, 28 Jun 2009 15:55:48 GMT

jk1002:

Difference I believe is, Apple does that on purpose, B&O is just not organized well enough.

Perhaps. Who knows. I don't know how much of it is 'done on purpose' and how much of it is controlled. When you sell hundreds of thousands of products to, erm, passionate users, those people can often return things with the slightest problem. I'm not including you with those users, but I'm sure Apple don't just fix any and every issue, 'just because'. If they did, word would get around and lots of people would suddenly have those hinge issues.

B&O are stubborn though. It's not just organisational issues. They stubbornly refuse to interact or talk to their users regarding any issues. They don't even talk to most member of the press, including our consumer tech magazines!! They don't even answer our emails!

Re: How hard is Bang & Olufsen hit ?

jk1002 — Sun, 28 Jun 2009 15:44:12 GMT

>>) Apple are far better at talking to their customers directly and resolving issues,<<

That is not true. I just recall the Macbook Air "hinge" problem. Mine has that, there is no acknowledgement an done has to argue with them.

Also, there is a thread on their own support forum, running 6 month or so about a bug in the OS that caused a crackling sound when trying to use a blue tooth headset. That was a problem across all their computer models and no word if they are working on it or not.

Difference I believe is, Apple does that on purpose, B&O is just not organized well enough.

Re: How hard is Bang & Olufsen hit ?

moxxey — Sun, 28 Jun 2009 15:33:22 GMT

TripEnglish:

Not really defending us as I agree that some Danes need to pull their heads out of their a$ses, but I'm as sick of hearing about Apple as though it was handed down from the Gods as some forum members are of hearing the "take our defects and say thank you" line from some posters.

I agree Trip. I know of a large number of colleagues who have had to return and replace their iPhone.

However, three differences:

1) the Apple products are very cheap, in comparison. We're talking sw problems with some of B&Os premier products.

2) there are many many more Apple products (than B&O kit), so statistically you're likely to find people who have had some kind of problem with Apple kit

3) Apple are far better at talking to their customers directly and resolving issues, I've found. B&O aren't. They completely rely on their dealers. They do not and won't talk directly to their customers, issue an apology, call to see if their relationship with their dealer is causing issues and so on. Apple do. You can call Apple!

Re: How hard is Bang & Olufsen hit ?

TripEnglish — Sun, 28 Jun 2009 14:59:31 GMT

vikinguk:

And as I plough through the Sunday Times again I find an article by Matt Rudd listing all the high tech products he has that don't fulfill their promised function. No mention of B&O but the headline....... 'The iPhone's best trick: it works.'

Final para re poor performing products......... 'I accept all this without complaint because I am used to technology not doing what it's supposed to do. But iPhones are the exception to the rule and if Apple made cars I'd buy one. And, when the company announced a better version, complete with slightly better wipers, I'd buy it. Like a million other mugs.'

Apple may not need B&O but B&O needs to get back to a position where enough buyers are happy enough to repeatedly buy their latest premium priced products in the knowledge that they will exceed expectations.

Graham

Oh please. Sounds like Walt Mossberg! The reality is that Apple products work fine when they work, but their failure rates are getting outlandish. In the past 12 months alone I've had to replace my MacBook Air once and have since had it in for two repairs and four trips to the store for tech support, replaced an iPhone 3 times, and replaced my wife's iPhone twice (with another one on the way judging by the way the speakers seem to be crackling). That's appalling and in my 1o year history of buying Apple it's going downhill.

Not really defending us as I agree that some Danes need to pull their heads out of their a$ses, but I'm as sick of hearing about Apple as though it was handed down from the Gods as some forum members are of hearing the "take our defects and say thank you" line from some posters.

Re: How hard is Bang & Olufsen hit ?

moxxey — Sun, 28 Jun 2009 13:49:46 GMT

vikinguk:

Apple may not need B&O but B&O needs to get back to a position where enough buyers are happy enough to repeatedly buy their latest premium priced products in the knowledge that they will exceed expectations.

Graham

And I agree Graham. However, according to Razlaw, we should put up and shut up! If there are major issues (and I'd regard red lines as major issues across my new MKIV), I want resolution.

Re: How hard is Bang & Olufsen hit ?

vikinger — Sun, 28 Jun 2009 10:22:08 GMT

And as I plough through the Sunday Times again I find an article by Matt Rudd listing all the high tech products he has that don't fulfill their promised function. No mention of B&O but the headline....... 'The iPhone's best trick: it works.'

Final para re poor performing products......... 'I accept all this without complaint because I am used to technology not doing what it's supposed to do. But iPhones are the exception to the rule and if Apple made cars I'd buy one. And, when the company announced a better version, complete with slightly better wipers, I'd buy it. Like a million other mugs.'

Apple may not need B&O but B&O needs to get back to a position where enough buyers are happy enough to repeatedly buy their latest premium priced products in the knowledge that they will exceed expectations.

Graham

Re: How hard is Bang & Olufsen hit ?

moxxey — Sun, 28 Jun 2009 10:12:54 GMT

vikinguk:

Really bad news should B&O need to raise any further funds in addition to slashing their costs and overheads.

I wonder what B&Os cash reserves are, if indeed they have any? Most companies build up cash in good times so they can ride bad times and invest in technology if they needs rises, in the future.

As they are made a loss up to February 2009 (and I can't imagine it's improved since then), to cover that loss, they would have had to dig in to cash reserves.