General Forum

Re: BS3 - DTS-HD??

355f — Sat, 21 Jun 2008 04:53:53 GMT

moxxey:

Thanks 355f, that puts things in to perspective. I can also see why people would hold off purchasing a new BS3 (£5K?), when their £270 Playstation 3 supports later standards.
My understanding is that we won't be able to upgrade our existing BS3 as HDMI 1.3 is requierd for DTS-HD and that's a hardware upgrade? TripEnglish said it was a sw upgrade, but I'm sure HDMI 1.3 requires a change in components?

You are correct.

As you know some of the debates I have started relate to cost of B&Oproducts. One can justify the costs if the product is designed in such a way that upgrades can be completed at a sensible price to allow for changes such as we have discussed.

I dont know for sure- but looking at the inside of BS3 leads me to understand that it will require part changes not via sw upgrade.- potentially very expensive.

Its an interesting one about B&O developing BR- this is aformat that requires frequent updates to firmware to keep it a worthwhile medium- B&O cant rely on the dealers to do this. Sony issue firmware updates every 6/8 weeks and as you know on PS3 its via the net if you so desire- its a perfect solution!

Unless B&O get BR undate solutions right i would neevr want a bv7 with inbuilt blue ray!

Re: BS3 - DTS-HD??

moxxey — Sat, 21 Jun 2008 03:33:43 GMT

Thanks 355f, that puts things in to perspective. I can also see why people would hold off purchasing a new BS3 (£5K?), when their £270 Playstation 3 supports later standards.

My understanding is that we won't be able to upgrade our existing BS3 as HDMI 1.3 is requierd for DTS-HD and that's a hardware upgrade? TripEnglish said it was a sw upgrade, but I'm sure HDMI 1.3 requires a change in components?

Re: BS3 - DTS-HD??

355f — Fri, 20 Jun 2008 17:49:57 GMT

moxxey:

A question for you all. The latest Rambo Blu-ray DVD *only* outputs audio as DTS-HD 7.1. My Playstation 3 supports output of DTS-HD.
So, what's my BV7-40 MKIII decoding and playing back? I have a BL9, 7.4, BL2 combo and the sound is absolutely fantastic with this movie, so I'm unsure how this experience can be enhanced.

Playstation 3 supports HD but over hdmi BS3 doesnt. You are listening to DTS 5.1

In the case of the Rambo movie you mentioned I doubt that the experience could be that much better as its sound track is bass dominated- an 'action movie' Where the difference will be noticed is a music DVD or where there is a soundtrack to the movie that has a little substance.

The most practical way of looking at it is to listen to a dvd sound track and then the same as a music CD sound track- the difference is huge and of course larger still with HD dts.

Re: BS3 - DTS-HD??

moxxey — Fri, 20 Jun 2008 17:12:42 GMT

A question for you all. The latest Rambo Blu-ray DVD *only* outputs audio as DTS-HD 7.1. My Playstation 3 supports output of DTS-HD.

So, what's my BV7-40 MKIII decoding and playing back? I have a BL9, 7.4, BL2 combo and the sound is absolutely fantastic with this movie, so I'm unsure how this experience can be enhanced.

Re: BS3 - DTS-HD??

beojeff — Fri, 20 Jun 2008 15:38:04 GMT

With firmware update 2.35, the PS3 can now finally output DTS-HD, too.

Re: BS3 - DTS-HD??

Alex — Fri, 20 Jun 2008 12:44:10 GMT

DTS-HD can supply higher quality sound than CD by a considerable amount (technically).

With CD, you have 65,536 'lines' of resolution, which is 'refreshed' 44,100 times a second.

With DTS-HD, you have 16,777,216 'lines' of resolution, which is refreshed up to 192,000 times a second.

Although psycho-acoustically, the sound improvement isn't as big as the tech-specs would have you believe, there is still a marked improvement.

Either way, this will leave the most common format, Dolby Digital sitting in the dark (which is basically 160 kbps AAC).

Re: BS3 - DTS-HD??

355f — Fri, 20 Jun 2008 07:46:47 GMT

beopaul:

The BS3 itself will not decode those formats, but practically all Blu-ray players decode these formats internally, and the BS3 can handle these decoded channels over HDMI. In fact there are advantages to the player doing the decoder, so for now, I don't find lack of BS3 decoding a big deal, but would change my mind if future devices came out that didn't do this decoding.
BS3-based DTS-HD/True-HD decoding would require HDMI 1.3, which would require a hardware change to the BS3, which currently can't handle that fast of a bitstream. I don't know if this would be a board swap, or would even be possible.
-- Paul

In fact not many players decode the HD formats internally and only the latest player from Panasonic the BD50( not yet released here) some Denon players. The others will not do it.

Accepting that there will be small differences in picture quality bought about by very small improvements in blue ray, the biggest advantages of the format for the future is HD audio and when properly mastered it brings a new realism to the audio experience.

A debate as to why one should bother is rather similar to- why bother with 5.1 when most of the time the rear speakers are for fill in.

DTS-HD Master Audio delivers sound that is bit-for-bit identical to the studio master. It can deliver audio at variable bit rates which are significantly higher than standard DVDs. DTS-HD Master Audio can provide up to 7.1 audio channels at a 96k sampling frequency / 24-bit depth or 5.1 audio channels at 192 kHz that are identical to the original master. The DTS-HD Master Audio bit stream also contains the DTS 1.5 Mbps core for backwards compatibility with existing DTS-enabled home theater systems, and delivery of 5.1 channels of sound at twice the resolution found on most standard DVDs.

Re: BS3 - DTS-HD??

kawo — Fri, 20 Jun 2008 06:22:41 GMT

Unfortunately only a few Blue Ray Player decode the HD Audio channels internaly and are able to pass them to the receiver (e.g. BS3) over HDMI. Most of them pass through the HD channels un-decoded.

For example, the new Panasonic BMP-50 does decode the HD Audio channels, the BMP 30 not.

Karsten

Re: BS3 - DTS-HD??

moxxey — Fri, 20 Jun 2008 05:54:41 GMT

Yes, but query still stands: why? You say you would 'change my mind if future devices...didn't do this decoding'. Why is it so mission-critical? It requires HDMI 1.3 support, few Blu-ray discs ship with DTS-HD and other formats such as uncompressed PCM are hard to beat, which the BS3 supports.

Yes, 24fps support is fairly important as you can see some stuttering when the camera pans on a Blu-ray disc, but I can't see how DTS-HD support will add further to my audio experience. Has anyone got an answer?

Re: BS3 - DTS-HD??

beopaul — Thu, 19 Jun 2008 20:01:03 GMT

The BS3 itself will not decode those formats, but practically all Blu-ray players decode these formats internally, and the BS3 can handle these decoded channels over HDMI. In fact there are advantages to the player doing the decoder, so for now, I don't find lack of BS3 decoding a big deal, but would change my mind if future devices came out that didn't do this decoding.

BS3-based DTS-HD/True-HD decoding would require HDMI 1.3, which would require a hardware change to the BS3, which currently can't handle that fast of a bitstream. I don't know if this would be a board swap, or would even be possible.

-- Paul

Re: BS3 - DTS-HD??

moxxey — Thu, 19 Jun 2008 13:49:09 GMT

Maybe I'll sound niave, but is DTS-HD support essential? Audio from any Blu-ray disc is superb, often presented as uncompressed PCM or similar. In fact, it's so good on my BL9's, I've had to turn down the bass, turn off the subwoofer and so on.

What does DTS-HD offer in additon to what's found on an existing Blu-ray disc?

Re: BS3 - DTS-HD??

mr_anders_son — Thu, 19 Jun 2008 12:10:23 GMT

apearce:

Hi,
Can anyone confirm that the latest sortware/firmware for the BS3 will support DTS-HD/True-HD??
Thanks

Not

BS3 - DTS-HD??

apearce — Thu, 19 Jun 2008 09:46:08 GMT

Hi,

Can anyone confirm that the latest sortware/firmware for the BS3 will support DTS-HD/True-HD??

Thanks