a2bur:

What' the best alternative to the Bv7-40 , I cannot justify the price tag for a less than perfect Tv ? I was a whisker away from ordering one but after going to PcWorld for a cable I was distracted by there Tv's , superb picture ( Starwars ) and a 50" for £999 , don't know what  SD picture is like on it thou , but the 7-40 isn't good either . My first thought was a BeoSystem3 , should be easy to connect all my powerlink speakers and control everything with the Beo4 , but what make/type of screen must it be to do this ? Is there an alternative to the BeoSystem3 set-up bearing in mind the speakers , sky+ , audio I have and wish to control everything with the Beo4 ?

Richard

Pioneer Kuro? That would have been my non-B&O choice.

For what you want to do, the BeoVision 7-40 is the only 'seamless' solution. The software has now been fixed so SD appears much better than the original 'pixellated' image many reported.

The 7-40 will definitely outperform the TVs you saw in PC world, especially with an HD signal.

If you think about it, once you add a BeoLab 7 and BeoSystem 3, you're not far off the price of a BeoVision 7-40, and the 7-40 will be a lot more perfect than a brand X TV + a BS3 'bodged' together.

Alex:

For what you want to do, the BeoVision 7-40 is the only 'seamless' solution. The software has now been fixed so SD appears much better than the original 'pixellated' image many reported.

The 7-40 will definitely outperform the TVs you saw in PC world, especially with an HD signal.

If you think about it, once you add a BeoLab 7 and BeoSystem 3, you're not far off the price of a BeoVision 7-40, and the 7-40 will be a lot more perfect than a brand X TV + a BS3 'bodged' together.

 

I stongly disagree with this statement!

The 'fix from BnO for the poor SD image was to alter the sharpness on the settings so you dont see it as much!! thats not a solution at all.

I dont want to get into another debate about the BV7 but the fact is it is a product that in vision terms is outclassed by many cheaper products out there.

Look at a Pioneer Kuro- superior in every way to a BV9, or get the BS3 and match it to a pansonic PF10( which is the base ofthe BV4 anyway- then you are not bodging anything.

Have to agree with 355f here. The only disagreement would be the 'in every way' as the Beovisions will integrate with the Beolab speakers and your sound system. I think I would probably go with the BS3 and another make screen and get another make Blu-ray DVD player. Or maybe a Pioneer and a Lintronic box.

Having said that, I am not getting anything at present as I don't think the formats are stable yet and am happy with my current set up. 

Alex:

The 7-40 will definitely outperform the TVs you saw in PC world, especially with an HD signal.

....and which TV's did he see exactly?? I'm not sure sweeping statements like this are particularly helpful

Puncher:

Alex:

The 7-40 will definitely outperform the TVs you saw in PC world, especially with an HD signal.

....and which TV's did he see exactly?? I'm not sure sweeping statements like this are particularly helpful

Can't say I remember exact model names, they're all very similar in terms of design/naming etc... but there were a lot of Philips and Samsung models, a few Pioneers (which seemed to be the best in the plasma field) and some, erm, Hyundais

The 7-32 is a different machine. Nothing like the connection possibilities - why do you want to change the BV3? It will have a better picture!

With a digital source, I would not say the BV3 is better.... However, if I owned a BV3 there would be no reason to trade it in for LCD.

With SD, which is the vast majority of what we get, it will be better. It has more colours and is brighter. I agree HD material will be possibly better but at 32", the difference will be slight.

Having had both a BV3 and now a BV7-40 MKIII, I have to say some of the comments surprise me on this thread. Here is what you'll see as a difference:

 - Firstly, the BV7-40 will optically look tighter in the room than your current BV3. I found that by not having the large B&O storage unit beneath the display ultimately made the television not look any bigger in my lounge and I have to say my 21x14 lounge is not that big.  I have the 7.4 beneath my system and somehow that just makes the whole thing look smaller. What I would suggest is that you ask your dealer to bring the unit round to your house like my dealer did. It was a revelation. It is actually about 10 cm wider, but can sit further back to the wall.

- For the most part, I watch content on the Sky box, from BBC1 to Movies. For the most part you'll experience equal to slightly better picture quality. If you run the HD channels, then clearly you gain a major jump in quality. If you run analogue TV then the quality is inferior, and on the Digital Card, the quality differs dependant on the channel - its really down to the compression being used by the channel that determines the quality here and regardless of whatever anyone says, this issue is a symptom across all tvs and can only be masked by smoothing/blending/blurring algorithms, which is essentially what B&O have introduced in the 4.01 update. There is no TV that can take a highly compressed image and turn it into something beautiful. So Panasonic, Pioneer will be no better technically, but maybe subjectively - but the problem will disappear with time and ultimately these subjectively better products will become inferior as the transmission quality is ramped up. The purity and accuracy of the BV7 with the BS3 chassis will shine through - this is a long term investment TV.

- The next reason for selecting this TV is the integrated BeoSystem 3. Essentially this is nothing short of a high performance computer that supports the inputs you are definitely going to require at some stage. Whether you choose Blu Ray, a game console, a media centre (like Apple TV), they are going to require HDMI for optimal performance. This was the core reason I waited for B&O to release this product - not just the connections - but the high performance digital capabilities of this new systems. Unlike these other TVs, your BV7 is only ever going to improve - especially since they are able to add codecs through firmware (in 3.0 they added AAC support.) Having H.264 and Enhanced AAC are going to be key in the future of TV - witness the BBC's iPlayer and other projects in the TV world and the HD content on Apple TV. The quality will only go UP! Other TV's that have a subjective advantage today will likely stand still.

- The BV7-40 is not a 2-3 year ownership prospect - especially at £8800 for an all-up system. Its likely to be in your lounge much longer and that is why its the TV to go for...

 Thats my 2 cents worth. I think it would also help if the Avant owners who keep screaming that they continue to have the best TV went and had a look at a BV7-40 MK III with a Apple TV Take 2 and watched a couple of trailers. That's the beauty of H.264, the content owners can just turn up the quality at a flick of a switch and keep on elevating the experience, whereas the Avant peaked several years ago - good as it is.

Hope that helps, Mark.

 

 

 

 

 

 

355f wrote: “I dont want to get into another debate about the BV7 but the fact is it is a product that in vision terms is outclassed by many cheaper products out there. Look at a Pioneer Kuro- superior in every way to a BV9, or get the BS3 and match it to a pansonic PF10( which is the base ofthe BV4 anyway- then you are not bodging anything”

Well, if you don't want a debate, then you must want the last word. It isn't that easy. BV4, 7, and 9 are system products and comparing them to a tv is like comparing your 355f to a Viper; in one or two ways the Viper is better, but which would you rather own?

While I don't know anyone who is frothing at the mouth to buy at BV9 at $20k US, that doesn't mean that there isn't real value in the aesthetics, center channel, motorized stand, multi-room capability, build quality, warranty, and the materials used. When you add white glove service and continual improvement of the processor and software, then the essence of the product makes it completely different from the Kuro or its ilk. I work with a lot of people who sell those type products, and most can't run off fast enough after the check clears. Return trips? Hah! And (in my own experience) getting warranty service for some with even the best reputation (NEC for example) is H-E-Double Hockey Sticks, at best. White glove? Add an extra $600, for example, and pray you don't need it. The Bang & Olufsen dealer cannot operate in a strictly transactional manner with its customers, and that has a value for some people.

The BS3 and BV7 updates that were mentioned in another thread regarding Playstation 3 happened in mid-December and late January. When the software is upgraded, it is up to the dealer to ensure that the client is kept up to date. Struer (though it appears far from perfect) cannot be responsible for performance in the field, though all stakeholders eventually pay the price for failure in the field. And while the next new thing from another brand will address many issues, the ones they don't address will never be addressed for that model. Time for a new one.

I feel for those of you who do have problems with SD material and the BV7. I have never witnessed this issue. In most of the US there are no more analog stations, and what exist will be gone in a few months. Because most of the material in the US comes through a STB, analog stations tend to look awful when stretched, and the cable or satellite company has most of the control over it. The BV7 handles over-the-air digital and HD material very nicely. At home I have 100 channels, but only watch the 20 or so that are HD. I would imagine that every market has some kind of issue with transmission.

And for those of you who appreciate the 2^nd life market (love that UK term), be happy that there IS one. We can't give away a 2 year-old Pioneer Elite that, by the way, the owner paid $7500 for. Why? It's just a screen and a processor, and though it was a fine one, the spec junkies reject it completely. I can ALWAYS find someone who will give something for a B&O product.

For me, I guess its far more than contrast ratio that floats my boat.  Value is very personal, and it is an argument nobody can ever win.  So that is my worldview.  r

mawheele:

Having had both a BV3 and now a BV7-40 MKIII, I have to say some of the comments surprise me on this thread. Here is what you'll see as a difference:

 - Firstly, the BV7-40 will optically look tighter in the room than your current BV3. I found that by not having the large B&O storage unit beneath the display ultimately made the television not look any bigger in my lounge and I have to say my 21x14 lounge is not that big.  I have the 7.4 beneath my system and somehow that just makes the whole thing look smaller. What I would suggest is that you ask your dealer to bring the unit round to your house like my dealer did. It was a revelation. It is actually about 10 cm wider, but can sit further back to the wall.

- For the most part, I watch content on the Sky box, from BBC1 to Movies. For the most part you'll experience equal to slightly better picture quality. If you run the HD channels, then clearly you gain a major jump in quality. If you run analogue TV then the quality is inferior, and on the Digital Card, the quality differs dependant on the channel - its really down to the compression being used by the channel that determines the quality here and regardless of whatever anyone says, this issue is a symptom across all tvs and can only be masked by smoothing/blending/blurring algorithms, which is essentially what B&O have introduced in the 4.01 update. There is no TV that can take a highly compressed image and turn it into something beautiful. So Panasonic, Pioneer will be no better technically, but maybe subjectively - but the problem will disappear with time and ultimately these subjectively better products will become inferior as the transmission quality is ramped up. The purity and accuracy of the BV7 with the BS3 chassis will shine through - this is a long term investment TV.

- The next reason for selecting this TV is the integrated BeoSystem 3. Essentially this is nothing short of a high performance computer that supports the inputs you are definitely going to require at some stage. Whether you choose Blu Ray, a game console, a media centre (like Apple TV), they are going to require HDMI for optimal performance. This was the core reason I waited for B&O to release this product - not just the connections - but the high performance digital capabilities of this new systems. Unlike these other TVs, your BV7 is only ever going to improve - especially since they are able to add codecs through firmware (in 3.0 they added AAC support.) Having H.264 and Enhanced AAC are going to be key in the future of TV - witness the BBC's iPlayer and other projects in the TV world and the HD content on Apple TV. The quality will only go UP! Other TV's that have a subjective advantage today will likely stand still.

- The BV7-40 is not a 2-3 year ownership prospect - especially at £8800 for an all-up system. Its likely to be in your lounge much longer and that is why its the TV to go for...

 Thats my 2 cents worth. I think it would also help if the Avant owners who keep screaming that they continue to have the best TV went and had a look at a BV7-40 MK III with a Apple TV Take 2 and watched a couple of trailers. That's the beauty of H.264, the content owners can just turn up the quality at a flick of a switch and keep on elevating the experience, whereas the Avant peaked several years ago - good as it is.

Hope that helps, Mark.

 

 

 

 

 

 

'some of the comments surprise you on this thread'- this one has left me- well lost for words! Do you work for BnO marketing ?

All in all - very 'interesting' take on the situation and im pleased one is delighted with the long term investment on this product and the fact that 'image quality' will shine through long after the others !!

Its also interesting to note you feel that the avant is now confined to the history books when comparing the image quality to the BV7

This is therefore the only LCD TV by any manufacturer on earth thats achieved this accolade and the 'high performance digital capabilities' will see one through the comming years!!

symmes:

355f wrote: “I dont want to get into another debate about the BV7 but the fact is it is a product that in vision terms is outclassed by many cheaper products out there. Look at a Pioneer Kuro- superior in every way to a BV9, or get the BS3 and match it to a pansonic PF10( which is the base ofthe BV4 anyway- then you are not bodging anything”

Well, if you don't want a debate, then you must want the last word. It isn't that easy. BV4, 7, and 9 are system products and comparing them to a tv is like comparing your 355f to a Viper; in one or two ways the Viper is better, but which would you rather own?

While I don't know anyone who is frothing at the mouth to buy at BV9 at $20k US, that doesn't mean that there isn't real value in the aesthetics, center channel, motorized stand, multi-room capability, build quality, warranty, and the materials used. When you add white glove service and continual improvement of the processor and software, then the essence of the product makes it completely different from the Kuro or its ilk. I work with a lot of people who sell those type products, and most can't run off fast enough after the check clears. Return trips? Hah! And (in my own experience) getting warranty service for some with even the best reputation (NEC for example) is H-E-Double Hockey Sticks, at best. White glove? Add an extra $600, for example, and pray you don't need it. The Bang & Olufsen dealer cannot operate in a strictly transactional manner with its customers, and that has a value for some people.

The BS3 and BV7 updates that were mentioned in another thread regarding Playstation 3 happened in mid-December and late January. When the software is upgraded, it is up to the dealer to ensure that the client is kept up to date. Struer (though it appears far from perfect) cannot be responsible for performance in the field, though all stakeholders eventually pay the price for failure in the field. And while the next new thing from another brand will address many issues, the ones they don't address will never be addressed for that model. Time for a new one.

I feel for those of you who do have problems with SD material and the BV7. I have never witnessed this issue. In most of the US there are no more analog stations, and what exist will be gone in a few months. Because most of the material in the US comes through a STB, analog stations tend to look awful when stretched, and the cable or satellite company has most of the control over it. The BV7 handles over-the-air digital and HD material very nicely. At home I have 100 channels, but only watch the 20 or so that are HD. I would imagine that every market has some kind of issue with transmission.

And for those of you who appreciate the 2^nd life market (love that UK term), be happy that there IS one. We can't give away a 2 year-old Pioneer Elite that, by the way, the owner paid $7500 for. Why? It's just a screen and a processor, and though it was a fine one, the spec junkies reject it completely. I can ALWAYS find someone who will give something for a B&O product.

For me, I guess its far more than contrast ratio that floats my boat.  Value is very personal, and it is an argument nobody can ever win.  So that is my worldview.  r

well i dont want the last word either but since you have quoted me i feel compelled to answer. the 355 is long gone so we can forget that debate!

Its just as well that contrast ratio is 'not the only thing that floats your boat'!!

Its the white glove service that intrigues me! -looking forward to that. Is this where the dealer after some months comes out to fix serious shortcommings to  the TV that would never  be present in a set costing 20% of the price? ( and if it was it would be replaced without question?

If a manufacturer is selling an HD  product I just cant understand your debate that that 'BnO cant be responsible for performance in the field' when the PS3 and others are the mainstay of HD!! _AMAZING!- every manufactuerer I know tests the main products that are likely to be be connected to it- not let the customers find out and do the market researchon  their behalf!!

When it comes to second life, it was true in the past particularly with BnO audio that there was a strong aftermarket.

For BnO vision this is largely over so dont make a purchasing decision based purely on residual value!!  I purchased a BV4 with BS2 4 years ago- price was £11,400  its PX value was £1850.

I couold have bought five superior panels for that and thrown them all away after 1 year and still been in the money!

 

Value is of course a personal thing but one doesnt want to be brainwashed either.

 

Alex:

For what you want to do, the BeoVision 7-40 is the only 'seamless' solution. The software has now been fixed so SD appears much better than the original 'pixellated' image many reported.

Alex, I'd strongly suggest you look at these 'fixes' yourself before making statements like that. It's almost offensive to MKIII owners :)

The SD isue is no way near 'fixed'. It's exactly the same as before, even with sw 4.01! Watched MOTD on BBC1 last night, still as bad as ever. I also can't find the 'fix', which was supposed to be the inclusion of a sharpness setting in the customer service menu. Besides, it's the same as the sharpness in the service menu and that makes little difference and certainly isn't a 'fix'.

It's still as pixelated as ever.

I would definitely go for a BS3 based device - not the BV7-32. If the BV9 is just too big, then I suppose I would go for the BV7-40 - but I would take along some of your own DVDs to watch at the demo! I am afraid LCD just doesn't do it for me at present - but we are all different and like different aspects of what we see. I would have plasma any time over LCD but will probably get a projector next.

I think they only do the 4-50 now.

Peter :

I think they only do the 4-50 now.

 

O

Not sure if you can get a BV4-42 screen as spare part, however, Panasonic still sells them and the BS3 supports them as well.

The look of the panasonic 42 without the B&O frame is not that great, but the performance is equal (except for the anti-refelction screen)

But if you sum this up, not sure if you save a lot of money for a second best solution from the B&O perspective. For the 50" screen it is a different story

 

Karsten 

couldn't agree more

i think it just makes more profit - which is very short sighted

i've got an lcd , but the best pic i ever saw was a plasma at john lewis , it wasn't even hi def !

it was a 4 x 3 40" pioneer 1024 x 768 showing a dvd and the picture was STAGGERINGLY GOOD 

left an indelible image in my brain !!!