General Forum

Re: paging 355f

355f — Tue, 29 Jan 2008 16:55:41 GMT

moxxey:
355f:

The BV4 50 and the BV9 are of course an identical product in performance terms.
It's weird 335F. I agree with most of what you say about plasma, but if I take a look at, say, Casino Royale on Blu-ray on my BV7-40 MKIII compared to the BV4-50, the BV4-50 looks like it has more noise reduction. It looks more like how the Blu-ray DVD would appear on the BV7-40 MKII. If I reduce the sharpness on the MKIII, it gives the same effect.
I wonder what the sharpness level is set to on the dealer's BV4-50. I might check this when I next go in, as it's driven by the BS3 and my sharpness is now set to 12.

My associate recently bought a Pioneer Kuro and was delighted with it. To me although the image was superb it was 'larger than life' lots of contrast and colour.

I suggested an indvidual who would calibrate it and the results made the screen produce a very 'filmic' image- to me it was suberb and yet my associate disliked it and wanted the settings returned to normal.

My conclusion is that one 'gets used to' a particular image and anything else seems not to be the norm. In general a plasma set up in this way( as is the bv9/4) the image is smoother with the skin tones perfect and nicely balanced- easy to watch. LCD is the antithesis of this , cartoon reds and yellows are the hallmark of this technlogy it is not like the picture one would see at the cinema- whereas plasma is.

Re: paging 355f

moxxey — Tue, 29 Jan 2008 16:30:55 GMT

355f:
We all see images differently and it could well be, bearing in mind your previous comments that you just prefer LCD and thats fine.

We can't complain. A top quality HD image is going to look darned good on a BV7-40 MKIII, BV9 or BV4-50, I guess.

Re: paging 355f

soundproof — Tue, 29 Jan 2008 16:22:51 GMT

moxxey:
355f:
The BV4 50 and the BV9 are of course an identical product in performance terms.
It's weird 335F. I agree with most of what you say about plasma, but if I take a look at, say, Casino Royale on Blu-ray on my BV7-40 MKIII compared to the BV4-50, the BV4-50 looks like it has more noise reduction. It looks more like how the Blu-ray DVD would appear on the BV7-40 MKII. If I reduce the sharpness on the MKIII, it gives the same effect.
I wonder what the sharpness level is set to on the dealer's BV4-50. I might check this when I next go in, as it's driven by the BS3 and my sharpness is now set to 12.

I would not be confident that sets in dealerships are correctly set up (could even be that they have been temporarily set up for another source, and then they forgot to set it back.) I always check the setup menu before beginning to watch - and have had quite a few surprises in my time. (Though never like the two BL5s that had both been set to left channel, and had been playing left channel "mono" for weeks ...)

Re: paging 355f

355f — Tue, 29 Jan 2008 16:20:24 GMT

moxxey:
355f:

The BV4 50 and the BV9 are of course an identical product in performance terms.
It's weird 335F. I agree with most of what you say about plasma, but if I take a look at, say, Casino Royale on Blu-ray on my BV7-40 MKIII compared to the BV4-50, the BV4-50 looks like it has more noise reduction. It looks more like how the Blu-ray DVD would appear on the BV7-40 MKII. If I reduce the sharpness on the MKIII, it gives the same effect.
I wonder what the sharpness level is set to on the dealer's BV4-50. I might check this when I next go in, as it's driven by the BS3 and my sharpness is now set to 12.

I doubt the dealer has changed the settings beyond that set by the factory.

We all see images differently and it could well be, bearing in mind your previous comments that you just prefer LCD and thats fine.

Re: paging 355f

moxxey — Tue, 29 Jan 2008 16:10:52 GMT

355f:
The BV4 50 and the BV9 are of course an identical product in performance terms.

It's weird 335F. I agree with most of what you say about plasma, but if I take a look at, say, Casino Royale on Blu-ray on my BV7-40 MKIII compared to the BV4-50, the BV4-50 looks like it has more noise reduction. It looks more like how the Blu-ray DVD would appear on the BV7-40 MKII. If I reduce the sharpness on the MKIII, it gives the same effect.

I wonder what the sharpness level is set to on the dealer's BV4-50. I might check this when I next go in, as it's driven by the BS3 and my sharpness is now set to 12.

Re: paging 355f

355f — Tue, 29 Jan 2008 16:04:06 GMT

moxxey:
The Beonic Man:

To be fair to you Chris, and to be fair to the TV, you are right with what you say. I have seen HD content from Channel 4 on it and some of the footage is very good I agree. The SD footage is awful. I really think it has a long way to go though and I couldn't advise someone to pay BV7 money for the TV you get because I really don't think its worth it. I know I bought one so I know how this sounds but it was a mistake. I shouldn't have given in just because I wanted B&O, I should have waited until I was 100% happy with what I was buying. The BV7 is simply not good enough in my opinion.
Yes, SD-based football is terrible. Mind you, I have a Sony LCD owning friend and we both agreed that the Manchester Utd match on BBC1, on Sunday, was worse on his than the BV7-40. He thought it was 'unwatchable' on his TV and 'poor' on mine. I heard a rumour recently this was due to the BBC reducing their SD bandwidth over Sky.
I definitely agree on the price though - it's not worth the money.
Simon, take a look at that Ross Kemp in Afghanistan though, if you can, on Sky One HD. My gawd, this is absolutely amazing PQ.

well the problem there is that Sony cant make a decent LCD or plasma - which is why they gave up on plasma and should do the same with LCD

Re: paging 355f

moxxey — Tue, 29 Jan 2008 16:02:37 GMT

soundproof:
To end on a positive note: do have your cable/satellite signal checked. Often you can do this yourself, by accessing the STB setup menu. If it's borderline, see if you can get it fixed. It was, literally, of huge significance to me -- I even suspect that some of those grumbling about the BV8 image quality have sub-par signals. On mine the images look great - but I did stay at a hotel recently which had BV8s in the rooms with PQ that was totally off, due to bad signals ...

I've got to be honest, my Sky box states that my signal level is 'poor'. However, the HD quality is fantastic, so I wondered if the signal quality may be affecting SD. I might get this looked into. Even a slight knock to the Sky dish can affect the signal.

Re: paging 355f

moxxey — Tue, 29 Jan 2008 15:59:53 GMT

The Beonic Man:
To be fair to you Chris, and to be fair to the TV, you are right with what you say. I have seen HD content from Channel 4 on it and some of the footage is very good I agree. The SD footage is awful. I really think it has a long way to go though and I couldn't advise someone to pay BV7 money for the TV you get because I really don't think its worth it. I know I bought one so I know how this sounds but it was a mistake. I shouldn't have given in just because I wanted B&O, I should have waited until I was 100% happy with what I was buying. The BV7 is simply not good enough in my opinion.

Yes, SD-based football is terrible. Mind you, I have a Sony LCD owning friend and we both agreed that the Manchester Utd match on BBC1, on Sunday, was worse on his than the BV7-40. He thought it was 'unwatchable' on his TV and 'poor' on mine. I heard a rumour recently this was due to the BBC reducing their SD bandwidth over Sky.

I definitely agree on the price though - it's not worth the money. Also, if I moved and lost Sky HD, I'd be stuffed and far more disappointed with the PQ.

Simon, take a look at that Ross Kemp in Afghanistan though, if you can, on Sky One HD. My gawd, this is absolutely amazing PQ.

Re: paging 355f

soundproof — Tue, 29 Jan 2008 15:45:36 GMT

People should be wary of knocking the hardware for signal related problems.

I had my cable wiring and junction box replaced/checked when I bought my flatscreen. They measured the signal strength at the various outlets in my apartment and found it far below where it should be. Prior to the reinstallation I had a grainy and at times jittery SD picture - afterwards it was rock solid, and depending upon the channel I would say potentially translucent and 3D (at least that's how it seems now.)

Complaining about what SD signals look like on a full-HD screen is slightly silly, particularly given that most people do not have access to any full-HD signal, and do most of their watching at SD-resolutions.
This is, of course, a hobby horse of mine: HD-ready is as high a resolution as you should go for until we're (1) quite a few more years down the road, and we have regular access to full-HD; (2) the format war gets resolved, or we have ready access to full-HD downloads. The latter are available at 1080i now, in a very few instances.

Customers were misled by the press and salesmen to ask for a picture resolution they don't need, and are now stuck with screens they are unhappy with, due to having to upscale far out of proportion to the signal starting point.

To end on a positive note: do have your cable/satellite signal checked. Often you can do this yourself, by accessing the STB setup menu. If it's borderline, see if you can get it fixed. It was, literally, of huge significance to me -- I even suspect that some of those grumbling about the BV8 image quality have sub-par signals. On mine the images look great - but I did stay at a hotel recently which had BV8s in the rooms with PQ that was totally off, due to bad signals ...

Re: paging 355f

ed7 — Tue, 29 Jan 2008 15:15:49 GMT

Craig:

355f:
Why is it that that Samsung is placed on a pedestal as being a quality manufacturer? is it because BnO use them!
This was something I also believed to be true. Although I have to admit I am not that impressed with the 32" Samsung LCD we purchased last year for our eldest Son. Connected to a SD source the picture is not that good IMO.

Craig[:)
i agree with this statement 7-32 not up to the b&o standard picture-wise, i have seen bv4-65 picture was stunning but too big and expensive ,imho plasma is better TV's

Re: paging 355f

The Beonic Man — Tue, 29 Jan 2008 15:12:19 GMT

moxxey:
The Beonic Man:

but let me give you advance warning that the BV7 does not produce a great picture. I would say its OK and that's it.
Simon, this is so wrong. Please make sure you advise correctly. With *SD* you receive an 'OK' picture. With upscaled SD, you receive an excellent picture. With programmes filmed in HD (football on Sky Sports HD, films on Sky Movies HD, HD content through BBC HD or Sky One HD), the picture is outstanding.
Hey, I know this isn't the best example, but that Ross Kemp in Afghanistan, which is filmed in HD, is such a stunning image on my BV7-40 MKIII, it's worth watching just to admire the picture.
So, you need to say that the picture can be outstanding, depending on the source material.

To be fair to you Chris, and to be fair to the TV, you are right with what you say. I have seen HD content from Channel 4 on it and some of the footage is very good I agree. The SD footage is awful. I really think it has a long way to go though and I couldn't advise someone to pay BV7 money for the TV you get because I really don't think its worth it. I know I bought one so I know how this sounds but it was a mistake. I shouldn't have given in just because I wanted B&O, I should have waited until I was 100% happy with what I was buying. The BV7 is simply not good enough in my opinion.

Simon.

Re: paging 355f

Craig — Tue, 29 Jan 2008 14:41:19 GMT

355f:
Why is it that that Samsung is placed on a pedestal as being a quality manufacturer? is it because BnO use them!

This was something I also believed to be true. Although I have to admit I am not that impressed with the 32" Samsung LCD we purchased last year for our eldest Son. Connected to a SD source the picture is not that good IMO.

Craig

Re: paging 355f

355f — Tue, 29 Jan 2008 14:27:26 GMT

moxxey:
The Beonic Man:

This is a topic close to my heart. Myself and 355f have had many discussions around this subject and I must reiterate that plasma is definitely the way to go. Visit a specialist and see for yourself.
Sorry Simon, I disagree slightly. It depends on the source. Some HD programmes through the BV7-40 MKIII are outstanding and even leave the BV4-50 in the shade. Ok, perhaps not up to the BV9 level, but that's a step up from the BV7-40.
Some HD movies are stunning. Skin tones superb, black levels deep, no artifacts etc.
Where plasma really excels is SD content. However, we don't know where we're going to be in a couple of years time. I spend the majority of my time watching HD (or upscaled SD through HD channels, such as Channel 4 HD) and this content is superb. I'd definitely recommend the BV7-40 MKIII if you're planning on using it with a HD source. I'd definitely go with plasma if you're primarily watching SD or Freeview.

The BV4 50 and the BV9 are of course an identical product in performance terms.

Re: paging 355f

moxxey — Tue, 29 Jan 2008 14:13:54 GMT

The Beonic Man:
but let me give you advance warning that the BV7 does not produce a great picture. I would say its OK and that's it.

Simon, this is so wrong. Please make sure you advise correctly. With *SD* you receive an 'OK' picture. With upscaled SD, you receive an excellent picture. With programmes filmed in HD (football on Sky Sports HD, films on Sky Movies HD, HD content through BBC HD or Sky One HD), the picture is outstanding.

Hey, I know this isn't the best example, but that Ross Kemp in Afghanistan, which is filmed in HD, is such a stunning image on my BV7-40 MKIII, it's worth watching just to admire the picture.

So, you need to say that the picture can be outstanding, depending on the source material.

Re: paging 355f

moxxey — Tue, 29 Jan 2008 14:09:50 GMT

The Beonic Man:
This is a topic close to my heart. Myself and 355f have had many discussions around this subject and I must reiterate that plasma is definitely the way to go. Visit a specialist and see for yourself.

Sorry Simon, I disagree slightly. It depends on the source. Some HD programmes through the BV7-40 MKIII are outstanding and even leave the BV4-50 in the shade. Ok, perhaps not up to the BV9 level, but that's a step up from the BV7-40.

Some HD movies are stunning. Skin tones superb, black levels deep, no artifacts etc.

Where plasma really excels is SD content. However, we don't know where we're going to be in a couple of years time. I spend the majority of my time watching HD (or upscaled SD through HD channels, such as Channel 4 HD) and this content is superb. I'd definitely recommend the BV7-40 MKIII if you're planning on using it with a HD source. I'd definitely go with plasma if you're primarily watching SD or Freeview.